RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere?
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 10:13:02 PM
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WhiteRoseBlessings
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quote:
ORIGINAL: BillBaileyBFAFan
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ORIGINAL: WhiteRoseBlessings
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ORIGINAL: BillBaileyBFAFan
I think my point has been lost. I didnt really ask this, because of groups compromising to sing only what the church believed, but asked more out of concern for groups being associated with cultish churches, and churches who preach and teach bizzarro doctrine, like works salvation, or baptismal regeneration.
Say, if a SG group was asked to sing in a Catholic church? (not saying this would happen) but how many groups would want to be associated with that bunch?? Interesting choice of words.
So . . . what if a Southern Gospel group was singing somewhere and there were Catholics was in the audience? Would you recommend that the group refuse to sing until the Catholic person (people) left?
And why would is be so hard to imagine that a SG group would be invited to singe at a Catholic church?
And to carry that even further . . . what if a group went somewhere and there were not-yet believers in the audience?
Are you saying that a group should sing in front of only those they have deemed appropriate or worthy?
How does that line up Scripturally?
I'm not talking about audience members, good grief. I'm talking about perfoming as a guest of a church that you don't believe in what they do.
If I saw KINGSMEN QUARTET LIVE AT OUR MOTHER OF PERPETUAL WHATEVER THEY SAY....
I'd be concerned about what that group believed. I guess if you had a poster that read KINGSMEN QUARTET CHALLENGING CATHOLIC BELIEFS AND WINNING THEM TO CHRIST...that'd be better 
As I have repeatedly said, at least around where I live, guest preachers and singers, are representing the church they are singing at on that particular night Actually, no it would even be worse . . . at least for me.
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 10:18:18 PM
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rogasinger4Him
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I lead the singing at a non-denominational service for the antique dealers at the Scott Antique Market in atlanta every month and often sing southern gospel songs as part of the service. There is a Jewish lady who comes to the services because she likes the way I sing. I may never convince her to accept Jesus Christ as her Savior but I'm not going to stop trying to convince her to come to Jesus with the message in my songs. I certainly wouldn't ask her to leave because she isn't a Christian
There are many gays at this antique market and I invite them to the service too. So far none of them have shown up. But I'm not going to stop asking them.
Each of us, whether we are singers or not, is called to spread the good news to a lost and dying world and that's what I'm going to do each and every day. If some self-righteous pharisee acting person wishes to accuse me of being a drunken glutton who associates with sinners like the original Pharisees did Jesus that's OK with me.
I'll sing the message of love and salvation through Jesus Christ every single chance I get.
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 10:19:09 PM
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BillBaileyBFAFan
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ORIGINAL: WhiteRoseBlessings
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ORIGINAL: BillBaileyBFAFan
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ORIGINAL: Qtman
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ORIGINAL: danielmount
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ORIGINAL: Qtman
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ORIGINAL: danielmount
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ORIGINAL: Kerrlaw
I fail to see how preaching/performing/visiting a church amounts to an "endorsement".
...and yet, some people see it that way. A couple of years back, a SG soloist performed at a gay church, and that was construed by some as an endorsement of that church.
You are probably right Daniel. But those same people would find something wrong with Jesus Christ Himself.
Not necessarily. I wouldn't find something wrong with Jesus Christ himself, but if one of my favorite soloists or groups performed at an openly gay church (knowing it was such, and not encouraging the individuals there to come out of that sin), I would conclude that they were at least fine with others engaging in that particular behavior.
Would this openly gay church neew the Gospel shared with them. I would think they would. Is that not what SG Artist do. Do they not carry the Gospel to those that need it. And if anyone needed it it would be a gay church. If that group or soloist is singing about Jesus, Grace, and Salvation maybe it's just what they need to hear.
I can just hear the excuses now. I can see some group saying God I will go anywhere you send me to spread the Gospel but not to those gays. I don't think so.
I think you are missing the point. Yeah, it's fine to spread the gospel to gays, they need it, but typically at a concert, when are you gonna hear anything about gays? I have never heard a SG song or any other gospel song that said anything about homosexuals. When was the last time you heard a SG group sing about adultery? But like it or not, adultery is rampant in the Christian community.
The same could be applied to any sin. No one knows a person's heart except them and Our Lord (and even then, Our Lord knows more than we do of our hearts).
And I'm sure people who make up audiences have myriad sins either in their hearts or being actively lived that the SG groups don't know about. Just because someone goes somewhere where the sin is not as evident (as say versus going to a gay church) does not mean that sin doesn't exist among the people gathered.
That's why I think the best a group can hope for is to sing in churches whose doctrine agrees with what they are singing about, and that they should avoid churches that are in doctrinal disagreement with the message they are delivering. That's all I have contended, that a group know what a church they are singing at believes. It falls to the church to, to make sure they bring in singers who agree with them. The group is there to edify the Body, for the most part. They are there to entertain, to witness and to fellowship..
These things are hard when the church has radically different beliefs than what you ar singing, and will associate you with them, at least to some degree. I have really enjoyed this debae. It's been healthy, and hasnt degraded to name calling and spitting...I have got to get some sleep, so that I can function at work. God Bless you all for spirited conversation. Something we lack alot in life, it seems.
Agree of disagree I appreciate the mental excercise. God Bless, and good night.
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 10:28:24 PM
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WhiteRoseBlessings
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quote:
ORIGINAL: BillBaileyBFAFan
quote:
ORIGINAL: WhiteRoseBlessings
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ORIGINAL: BillBaileyBFAFan
I think you are missing the point. Yeah, it's fine to spread the gospel to gays, they need it, but typically at a concert, when are you gonna hear anything about gays? I have never heard a SG song or any other gospel song that said anything about homosexuals. When was the last time you heard a SG group sing about adultery? But like it or not, adultery is rampant in the Christian community.
The same could be applied to any sin. No one knows a person's heart except them and Our Lord (and even then, Our Lord knows more than we do of our hearts).
And I'm sure people who make up audiences have myriad sins either in their hearts or being actively lived that the SG groups don't know about. Just because someone goes somewhere where the sin is not as evident (as say versus going to a gay church) does not mean that sin doesn't exist among the people gathered.
That's why I think the best a group can hope for is to sing in churches whose doctrine agrees with what they are singing about, and that they should avoid churches that are in doctrinal disagreement with the message they are delivering. That's all I have contended, that a group know what a church they are singing at believes. It falls to the church to, to make sure they bring in singers who agree with them. The group is there to edify the Body, for the most part. They are there to entertain, to witness and to fellowship.. Just because a church theoretically holds to a specific group of doctrines doesn't mean that each person in that church adheres to those doctrines.
For examples . . . Our Lord tells us that we are to forgive one another. That's pretty much across-the-board, regardless of which Christian denomination one claims. During any given SG performance, there could be people in the audience harboring unforgiveness in their hearts.
Our Lord tells us that if a man looks at a woman with lust in his heart, then he has committed adultery with her. During any given SG performance there could be various men (and/or women) who are committed adultery via lust.
Etc, etc., etc.
What are you going to do? Poll the audience until it is gleaned to only the most clean and pure and completely sinless? That would leave no one left to listen NOR to sing.
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Hey there! This is Sharon-Marie, and you have reached my signature. I may not be here for a while; but if you'd like, please leave a message over in that ramblin’ thread.
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 10:57:11 PM
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Kerrlaw
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Smokymtnsanta
Who else matters????
Ahem...
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 11:12:00 PM
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crankius
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Great! Do you think the Wal-mart Cafe takes reservations?
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/14/2008 11:21:06 PM
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Kerrlaw
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Doggone it cranky, ya beat me to it.
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/15/2008 12:01:20 AM
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dbmurray
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quote:
ORIGINAL: BillBaileyBFAFan
That's why I think the best a group can hope for is to sing in churches whose doctrine agrees with what they are singing about, and that they should avoid churches that are in doctrinal disagreement with the message they are delivering. That's all I have contended, that a group know what a church they are singing at believes. It falls to the church to, to make sure they bring in singers who agree with them. The group is there to edify the Body, for the most part. They are there to entertain, to witness and to fellowship..
These things are hard when the church has radically different beliefs than what you ar singing, and will associate you with them, at least to some degree. I have really enjoyed this debae. It's been healthy, and hasnt degraded to name calling and spitting...I have got to get some sleep, so that I can function at work. God Bless you all for spirited conversation. Something we lack alot in life, it seems.
Agree of disagree I appreciate the mental excercise. God Bless, and good night.
How detailed are you going to be about your differences, though? There are some fairly significant differences between Southern Baptist doctrines and United Methodist, for example. And yet, one of the guys in one of the groups I play for is a Methodist minister, and one of the guys in the other group I play for is a Wesleyan minister.
Now, I noted that you said you meant extreme denominations in a previous post, but I disagree with your logic that a group is endorsing what a church stands for simply by being there at one service.
Two weeks ago, I performed at a festival where all sorts of groups were on the program...cloggers, country acts, etc. This is considered to be an "outreach" type of performance, where people who may not have come expecting to hear Gospel music hopefully respond to what we're doing. I'm not endorsing the other acts on the program, certainly. I'm just responsible for what I present during my time slot. The other group I play for has sung at a prison on a routine annual basis. I don't necessarily endorse the prison's "doctrines."
The point I'm failing to connect with you on is how that's any different from singing at a church where the differences in doctrine are typically minor in comparison to singing at a fair or a prison.
Now, for contrast, here's one situation where I would refuse to participate:
I won't sing in front of a storefront (Wal-Mart, K-Mart, etc.) while some church runs a fund raiser in the parking lot. I will sing for a fund raiser if it's taking place on church property or if the fund raiser is being held in the sort of location where people are coming specifically to attend that fund raiser. What I won't do is be part of an event that approaches the unsuspecting general public with hands outstretched asking for money. In my opinion, that's a poor way to present the Gospel to a lost and skeptical world.
Yet churches do this sort of thing all the time. They justify it with logic like "our Youth should raise their own money for activities" and "we're actually providing a service by having a car wash," etc. What they overlook is how a secular world views their motives. People who might otherwise be receptive to the Gospel have become jaded due to all the other unrelated "stuff" that is presented as part of "church." If an activity is drawing people in, that's one thing...but if it's turning people off to what church should represent, that's another.
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RE: Do Groups research doctrine, before singing somewhere? - 8/15/2008 1:11:50 AM
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singLOUD
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quote:
ORIGINAL: dbmurray
I won't sing in front of a storefront (Wal-Mart, K-Mart, etc.) while some church runs a fund raiser in the parking lot. I will sing for a fund raiser if it's taking place on church property or if the fund raiser is being held in the sort of location where people are coming specifically to attend that fund raiser. What I won't do is be part of an event that approaches the unsuspecting general public with hands outstretched asking for money. In my opinion, that's a poor way to present the Gospel to a lost and skeptical world.
Good point.
zzzzzzzzzzzz
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