Barak's Big Oil Ad (Full Version)

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Jhud -> Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 11:17:11 AM)

Barack's turn to go negative:

Big Oil Ad

That didn't take long.



todd_t -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 11:42:15 AM)

Did you expect Obama to take McCain's TV attacks without a retort?

Apparently, the man isn't willing to lie down in front of his opponent's media steamroller a la John Kerry.



Jhud -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 11:50:20 AM)

quote:

Did you expect Obama to take McCain's TV attacks without a retort?

Apparently, the man isn't willing to lie down in front of his opponent's media steamroller a la John Kerry.


I didn't expect that at all - in fact, I knew it was coming. Barack certainly isn't 'above' such attacks, and McCain's ads apparently drew blood.



Leon_Figg3 -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 11:50:26 AM)

Seems to me that Obama is the one with the steam roller.



EStan -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 11:59:20 AM)

Hey, Jack, let's discuss a hypothetical situation. Suppose a big company suddenly loses tax breaks from the government - in effect, thereby, having to pay more to operate that company. You don't suppose they would then pass those higher costs along to consumers, would you? [;)]



todd_t -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 12:07:28 PM)

quote:

I didn't expect that at all - in fact, I knew it was coming. Barack certainly isn't 'above' such attacks, and McCain's ads apparently drew blood.


Unfortunately, as loathsome as they usually are, negative ads tend to resonate with the masses, and responding to them is often the only may to prevent one's opponent from taking over the dialogue (again, see John Kerry - his campaign's greatest strategic blunder in '04 was in failing to go after the Swift Boaters and expose their bogus claims).



Evangel70 -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 1:00:40 PM)

quote:

Barack's turn to go negative:

Big Oil Ad

That didn't take long.


Notice BIG difference here. Obama goes after McCain's energy plan and NOT McCain. No attack on his character, military service, his wife, etc. McCain should follow suit.



Jhud -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 1:28:51 PM)

quote:

Notice BIG difference here. Obama goes after McCain's energy plan and NOT McCain. No attack on his character, military service, his wife, etc. McCain should follow suit.


McCain hasn't attacked Barak's "character, military service [lack of], [or] his wife".



rcjames -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 1:30:34 PM)

I was surpised that he did not mention airing up the tires to save the world from the evil oil companies; maybe he has flipped on that one also.

Thanks
RC



Beanteaser -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 1:40:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: EStan

Hey, Jack, let's discuss a hypothetical situation. Suppose a big company suddenly loses tax breaks from the government - in effect, thereby, having to pay more to operate that company. You don't suppose they would then pass those higher costs along to consumers, would you? [;)]



This is a great point. In fact, I would like to see them get another tax break IF it reduces my cost at the pump.



Jhud -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 1:58:36 PM)

quote:

Hey, Jack, let's discuss a hypothetical situation. Suppose a big company suddenly loses tax breaks from the government - in effect, thereby, having to pay more to operate that company. You don't suppose they would then pass those higher costs along to consumers, would you?


I missed this earlier, but that was my very first thought the minute I heard about this 'plan'.



HighPlainsDrifter -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 2:01:49 PM)

quote:


Notice BIG difference here. Obama goes after McCain's energy plan and NOT McCain. No attack on his character, military service, his wife, etc. McCain should follow suit.


No, he just has all his surrogates going after McCain's age.



inthysite -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 5:32:28 PM)

quote:

I was surpised that he did not mention airing up the tires to save the world from the evil oil companies; maybe he has flipped on that one also.


Oh but haven't you heard? He has.

Obama Signals Support for Wider Offshore Drilling

Now I want to hear all the liberals here say the same thing about NObama as they did about McCain when he changed his position on off shore drilling.



tafkam -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 6:02:19 PM)

quote:

again, see John Kerry - his campaign's greatest strategic blunder in '04 was in failing to go after the Swift Boaters and expose their bogus claims).


Perhaps because he knew he couldn't?



todd_t -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 6:56:42 PM)

Uh, yeah.

I'm sure some people do believe that, especially when among the entire cadre of swift boaters who claimed to have such deep insight into Kerry's wartime experience, none served alongside him during the combat incidents for which he earned his awards.

Corsi and O'Neill's "book" is nothing short of trash driven by their anger of Kerry's anti-war statements he made after Vietnam.

Neither of them have any grounds to question Kerry's wartime service, especially when the latter wasn't even in Vietnam at the same time as Kerry.

All politics aside, John Kerry served his country with as much merit as anyone else.



Evangel70 -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 7:31:32 PM)

quote:

Obama Signals Support for Wider Offshore Drilling

Now I want to hear all the liberals here say the same thing about NObama as they did about McCain when he changed his position on off shore drilling.


ORLANDO, Aug. 1 -- Sen. Barack Obama suggested on Friday that he could accept an expansion of offshore oil drilling as long as it was part of a broader package of measures that would free the logjam of energy bills in Congress.

"My interest is in making sure we've got the kind of comprehensive energy policy that can bring down gas prices,"

Good to hear the Obama is willing to change his position if it will benefit the country. We've had too many years of "my way or the highway" politics where the will of the people means nothing.

Anyone believing that offshore drilling is going to immediately effect the price at the pump and give us billions of gallons of oil by years end is simply fooling themselves.



iluvatar -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 7:37:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beanteaser

quote:

ORIGINAL: EStan

Hey, Jack, let's discuss a hypothetical situation. Suppose a big company suddenly loses tax breaks from the government - in effect, thereby, having to pay more to operate that company. You don't suppose they would then pass those higher costs along to consumers, would you? [;)]



This is a great point. In fact, I would like to see them get another tax break IF it reduces my cost at the pump.


What do you think is the likelihood of that happening?

That's why some people oppose tax breaks for big companies - many of them don't pass those savings to the consumers or the extra profits to their rank-n-file employees.

-Dan.



todd_t -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 7:58:27 PM)

IMO, such generous tax breaks are just another form of corporate welfare - in this case, to an industry that is literally swimming in money.

Not that making a profit is immoral; I'd just prefer to see government breaks (if any) doled out to businesses that actually need them.

As is, giving big oil such benefits is like giving Warren Buffet food stamps to help him buy milk and bread.



inthysite -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 8:15:45 PM)

quote:

Good to hear the Obama is willing to change his position if it will benefit the country. We've had too many years of "my way or the highway" politics where the will of the people means nothing.


I knew this was coming. When McCain switched positions to favor drilling because he thought it was in the best interest of the country all the liberals started yelling flip-flop, flip-flop. NObama does it and it's "I'm glad to have a guy willing to change position and not be hard headed!".

LOL, too funny! [:D][:D][:D][:D]



todd_t -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 8:33:49 PM)

quote:

I was surpised that he did not mention airing up the tires to save the world from the evil oil companies; maybe he has flipped on that one also.


Curiously, I just learned on MSNBC that in late June, John McCain attended a rally in California alongside the Governator and Florida Gov Charlie Crist (rumored by some to be a possible veep for McCain) on the topic of energy policy, and they included suggestions to the public on how they could help reduce their own fuel costs including (wait for it!) keeping one's tires at a correct pressure, and making regular tune-ups!

My goodness! And now McCain is mocking the same suggestions made by Obama last week, in addition to the Bush Energy Department and NASCAR.

I'll look for a link, but it seems McCain's sense of memory is quite selective.



Evangel70 -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 8:53:33 PM)

quote:

I knew this was coming. When McCain switched positions to favor drilling because he thought it was in the best interest of the country all the liberals started yelling flip-flop, flip-flop. NObama does it and it's "I'm glad to have a guy willing to change position and not be hard headed!".


Perhaps you missed this part of Obama's statement....

quote:

...as long as it was part of a broader package of measures that would free the logjam of energy bills in Congress.

"My interest is in making sure we've got the kind of comprehensive energy policy that can bring down gas prices,"


Wouldn't you agree that we need a comprehensive energy policy and not just a political sound bite of "drill and drill now"? Do you believe that if we drill today, we will drop oil prices tomorrow? McCain seems to think so, even when President Bush even says that drilling today won't do anything in the short run.



inthysite -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 8:58:28 PM)

quote:

Wouldn't you agree that we need a comprehensive energy policy and not just a political sound bite of "drill and drill now"? Do you believe that if we drill today, we will drop oil prices tomorrow? McCain seems to think so, even when President Bush even says that drilling today won't do anything in the short run.


Hey I'm not knocking NObama on this one. Yes I do believe that we need a comprehensive energy policy. FYI: McCain has one that includes drilling, building new refineries, building new nuclear plants, investing in new technology. Try reading his energy plan sometimes. (Oh and yes I read the whole article on NObama)

My point was and still is that when McCain changed his mind on offshore drilling he was "drilled". Now NObama does the exact same thing and it's "well it's part of a comprehensive energy plan so that's okay". Please!



todd_t -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/4/2008 11:36:41 PM)

Here are those links I promised outlining benefits in fuel savings from doing precisely what Charlie Crist, Arnold Schwarzenegger, and John McCain suggested at a joint appearance in June....or at least before Obama made the same suggestions last week, prompting Senator McCain to get himself into a big 'ol huff:

http://www.nascar.com/2007/auto/cct/09/11/car.care.fuel/

http://www.eere.energy.gov/afdc/vehicles/fuel_economy_tires_light.html

http://www.automotivedigest.com/view_art.asp?articlesID=23415

http://www.boston.com/news/science/articles/2004/12/02/schwarzenegger_aide_outlines_fuel_plans/

>>>

I'll try to find a few more later.



davemiller7 -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/5/2008 9:17:38 AM)

WOW!!! If we can save all this gas by keeping our tires inflated properly, can airlines save money by keeping their tires inflated also? That's good while they are taxiing down the runway, but what can they do when they are up in the air?

I KNOW!!! 55 MPH SPEED LIMIT!!!

-Dave



Beanteaser -> RE: Barak's Big Oil Ad (8/5/2008 9:45:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: iluvatar

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beanteaser

quote:

ORIGINAL: EStan

Hey, Jack, let's discuss a hypothetical situation. Suppose a big company suddenly loses tax breaks from the government - in effect, thereby, having to pay more to operate that company. You don't suppose they would then pass those higher costs along to consumers, would you? [;)]



This is a great point. In fact, I would like to see them get another tax break IF it reduces my cost at the pump.


What do you think is the likelihood of that happening?

That's why some people oppose tax breaks for big companies - many of them don't pass those savings to the consumers or the extra profits to their rank-n-file employees.

-Dan.


I think it's odd that the word "if" is always overlooked in these forums. I even made both letters bold.

I don't know how likely it is, that's why I used the word "if."



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