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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 1:55:44 PM
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Abishua
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quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
Then why did they want to stone Him? Could it be that they understood what you do not?
Jesus was comparing His position to that of Abraham. This was the reason they wanted to stone Him, because Jesus was claiming to be greater than "father Abraham".
Jesus used the very same words "I am" when being arrested, and yet this claim to be God (stating "I am") was never used against Him during their kangaroo court. Jesus did however claim to be the Messiah, the Son of God during the preceedings.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 2:21:05 PM
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justasheep
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Many have asserted in this thread that it is the Spirit which will ultimately illumine the heart to see Jesus for who he really is. I would completely agree and so would Jesus himself.
Much of the Gospels take the deity of Christ for granted. In Matt 5:17 Jesus said, “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."
What human teacher or mere son of God could ever be suspected of doing that? Only God could abolish the law. In fact, he does not abolish it, but does speak with amazing authority.
Matt 7:28-29 And when Jesus finished these sayings, the crowds were astonished at his teaching, 29 for he was teaching them as one who had authority, and not as their scribes.
Again in Matt 7:21-23 Jesus states that he has the right to determine who enters the kingdom of heaven.
I ask you , who but God could speak with such authority. Jesus wanted us, even expected us to understand that he was the Alpha and the Omega.
Jesus' egocentrism is even more obvious in the gospel of John. He draws attention to himself over and over.
"I am the bread of life." (John 6:48)
Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.” (John 8:12)
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. (John 14:6)
None of the prophets spoke with such authority, Jesus was constantly drawing attention to himself which would only be appropriate for God incarnate. If Jesus was not God this kind of egocentrism would be prideful and even blasphemous. Only if He is God is it admirable.
As C.S. Lewis said in Mere Christianity
A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic - on the level with a man who says he is a poached egg - or he would be the devil of hell. You must take your choice. Either this was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronising nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.
_____________________________
Life is wasted if we do not grasp the glory of the cross, cheerish it for the treasure that it is, and cleave to it as the highest price of every pleasure and the deepest comfort of every pain.
John Piper
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 3:15:19 PM
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Kath
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I have just removed quite a few posts for false teaching, a Terms of Service 15 violation.
Somehow the topic of this thread has veered from what Jesus had to say about Himself as God to if someone thinks Jesus is God. What you think about Jesus is not the topic, what Jesus had to say about Himself is.
I know he claimed to be the Messiah or son of God. BUT did he ever say he was GOD.
followup questions that also touch on the OP:
Would it be fair to say that God sent himself down with limited power?
I do see in the Bible where Jesus prayed to God. Was this to set an example or what was the main purpose? Maybe it was to get direction and answers.
Please stay on topic. Thank you.
Sincerely
Kath
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 3:55:27 PM
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terryjohn
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Jesus asks Peter who others say He is and Peter says people are saying He is a prophet like many before Him, in effect he was saying they thought he was just a man chosen by God. Then Christ gets very personal and asks Peter who he himself believed Christ to be. On Peter's confession that Christ was the Son of the Living God (God Himself), Christ said to make such a confession was one only God could reveal to a man. In short, it is not something that can be taught. For like all rebellious children we cry we must learn such things for ourselves. Blessed are we to whom God has reveal this to and cursed are we if men have to convince us of it.
The clear frustration is that Chrsit's claim to be God is the only conclusion we can reach, for if Christ were not God, then we have not seen the Father and do not know Him, and He certainly does not love us for He took from us our Christ for which we could never really be grateful for. Nevertheless, despite the necessity of Christs deity being a secret it is widely known by men and women of faith and love and on this confession Christ said He would build His church and it is on this confession that seperates the church from all other religions forever amen.
In theology this issue is referred to as the messianic secret. Faith demands much in that unless we believe that He is He we shall die in our sins. Joh 8:24 - I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am the one I claim to be, you will indeed die in your sins." Here you could say it was never important for Christ to prove that He was human.
Personally as a young christian I too prayed to God and Jesus and experienced the love and fruits of His Spirit, but soon I got the growing impression Christ was more than I gave Him credit for and as I searched scripture God revealed to me the shocking truth. I honestly was afraid of what I saw and understood, so much so that I could not sleep and had to confirm it by asking my older brother and a church elder, "Is Christ God?" To my relief they confirmed that He is. I was then shocked that no one preached this for suely it was important. And yet I soon found out a friend who spoke in tongues and loved Christ as I once had done did not know this when the topic came up. I fear she thought we who tired to tell her this though we were crazy and she soon dropped out of our group.
Christs deity is something only God Himself reveal much in the same way only God can give faith least men manufacture it for themselves thus making god in their own image.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 7:08:43 PM
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Abishua
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quote:
ORIGINAL: justasheep
......I ask you , who but God could speak with such authority. Jesus wanted us, even expected us to understand that he was the Alpha and the Omega....
God spoke of Himself in those terms, not Jesus.
From Isaiah: "Thus said YHWH, Sovereign of Israel, and his Redeemer, YHWH of hosts, ‘I am the First and I am the Last, besides Me there is no Elohim."
From the book of Revelation: “I am the ‘Alpha’ and the ‘Omega’, Beginning and End,” says God “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”
Throughout Scripture, those representing God (as His agents) have been given the authority to speak and act as though God Himself were speaking or acting.
< Message edited by Abishua -- 8/2/2008 7:28:02 PM >
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 7:12:32 PM
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armydude
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In that case, who exactly was Jesus to be able to "take away the sins of the world" as John the Baptist said He had come to do?
Edited to add a few more questions.
If Jesus was not God, how could He have risen from the dead?
If Jesus was not God, what good would it do to crucify Him?
< Message edited by armydude -- 8/2/2008 7:23:59 PM >
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 7:37:16 PM
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Abishua
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quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
In that case, who exactly was Jesus to be able to "take away the sins of the world" as John the Baptist said He had come to do?
Jesus is the Son of the Most High God, The spotless Lamb that takes away the sin of the world.
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
If Jesus was not God, how could He have risen from the dead?
Jesus did not raise Himself from the dead. The Almighty rose Jesus from the dead.
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
If Jesus was not God, what good would it do to crucify Him?
I am assuming you feel that only the death of God could atone for the sins of the world...If this is the case....Where is this premise supported in Scripture?
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 7:54:40 PM
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armydude
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Abishua
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
In that case, who exactly was Jesus to be able to "take away the sins of the world" as John the Baptist said He had come to do?
Jesus is the Son of the Most High God, The spotless Lamb that takes away the sin of the world. Saying the Son of God was the same as saying "God" in that culture. They understood that.quote:
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
If Jesus was not God, how could He have risen from the dead?
Jesus did not raise Himself from the dead. The Almighty rose Jesus from the dead. Scripture please?quote:
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
If Jesus was not God, what good would it do to crucify Him?
I am assuming you feel that only the death of God could atone for the sins of the world...If this is the case....Where is this premise supported in Scripture?
This can be answered in my first answer in this post. When interpreting the bible, don't forget who the original reader was.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 8:10:47 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Abishua
Jesus was not claiming diety when he said "before Abraham was, I am.
What was He claiming then? The remaining context of what is in Scripture has Jesus claiming He is God.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 8:13:57 PM
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armydude
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: Abishua
Jesus was not claiming diety when he said "before Abraham was, I am.
What was He claiming then? The remaining context of what is in Scripture has Jesus claiming He is God.
Precisely!
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 8:29:45 PM
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theo_book
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Fortydays
I know he claimed to be the Messiah or son of God. BUT did he ever say he was GOD. When I pray, I do pray to Jesus or God. BUt I really was wondering if I am doing this right. Did Jesus say he was God. Someone told me on my fishing website that Jesus never said he was God.
This is what has me wondering:
This is what was posted to me while I was trying to defend. I was at a lose for words! Help please....
"The plain fact is that there is not a single verse in the entire New Testament that makes the claim that Jesus is God. If such verses did indeed exist, then Christianity wouldn’t be splintered into so many hundreds, if not thousands, of sects, and the councils of Nicea and Constantinople would not have taken place to determine Jesus’ divinity."
John 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come [again] unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I. (KJV)
Jesus clearly states that he is less than God. That which is less than God cannot be the same as God.
Luke 2:52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man. (KJV)
Would God grow in wisdom and stature? Would God grow in His own favor?
JESUS IS THE SON OF THE FATHER:
2 John 1:3 Grace be with you, mercy, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ, THE SON OF the FATHER, in truth and love.
WE ARE ONE THE SAME WAY JESUS AND HIS FATHER ARE ONE:
John 17:11 "...Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that THEY may be ONE, AS WE ARE. 21 That THEY ALLl may be ONE; AS thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that THEY ALSO may be ONE in US: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that THEY MAY BE ONE, EVEN AS WE ARE ONE; 23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
HOWEVER Jesus and the Father are one, they are one with the disciples, IN THE SAME WAY..
Now, there are some who have joined the Jews who killed Jesus, in accusing him of claiming equality with God in John the tenth chapter. If you will examine this claim, that Jesus claimed equality with God in John 10, you will see that the text does not cerify that claim.
WHAT JESUS SAID IN JOHN 10:
30 I and my Father are one.
WHAT THE JEWS HEARD JESUS SAY:
30 I and my Father are one.
WHAT THE JEWS CLAIMED JESUS' WORDS MEANT:
33 The Jews answered him, saying...because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
WHAT JESUS SAID HIS WORDS MEANT
36.... I said, I am the Son of God?
There is no claim of equality with God anywhere in this exchange. There is only a correction by Jesus, ignored by the Jewish crowd and others.
NOTE: I have not said Jesus is not God. I have pointed out that John 10 is NOT a proof text that he is.
And for any who think to preach "yabut" arguments at me, I will not respond. What is a "Yabut" argument? It is an argument that responds to my post with "yabut what about...?? and proceeds to offer John 1:1 as some kind of proof of everything.
All I am dealing with in this post is responding to the query, "Did Jesus ever say he was God?" And he did not in John 10.
Fortunately, you have selected some of the best verses to begin your study with. Jesus DID grow in wisdom, therefore was not
"wisdom in the beginning" as some claim. Jesus DID claim "The Father is greater than I," making himself UNEQUAL WITH GOD.
I expect some flack from some of the "experts" on the board, and will prepare them for disappointment. I will not respond to cries of "heresey," or "blasphemy" or demands that I answer specific doctrinal questions. I am responding to a question that references specific scriptures,a nd the answer is not, not in these references, does Jesus claim to be God.
Now I aknowledge the questioner did not reference John 10, but the Jews in that reference made the argument that Jesus claimed to be God. I simply responded to the original question with that Jewish crowd in mind.
And what is significant to me, is that at Jesus' trial, the Jewish crowd did not being the charge against him, that he claimed to be God, but changed it to coincide with Jesus' statement found only here in John 10;
John 19:7 The Jews answered him, We have a law, and by our law he ought to die, because he made himself the SON OF GOD.
And even more significant, look again at the charge made by the Jews in John 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that GOD WAS HIS FATHER, making himself EQUAL WITH GOD.
The Jews did not believe this charge, and knew it was phony. And how do I know this? Because they made the same claim in John 8:41"...we have one Father, even God."
He made himself THE SON OF GOD. So even those Jews of John 10 did not believe he "made himself God." When it camt to testifying in a court of law, they said it like Jesus told them his words meant.
I HOPE THIS HELPS.
< Message edited by theo_book -- 8/2/2008 8:46:46 PM >
_____________________________
The most profound thing I learned in scripture is -
That God, who knows me best -
Loves me anyway.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 8:48:47 PM
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armydude
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But you've disproved yourself. Jesus said that He was the Son of God and then "I and my Father are One." You can't have that one both ways.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:04:59 PM
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theo_book
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quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
But you've disproved yourself. Jesus said that He was the Son of God and then "I and my Father are One." You can't have that one both ways.
Of course I can. Jesus and the Father are one EVEN AS Jesus and the Father and the disciples are one. But the disciples do not claim to be God, even though they are one with the Father and the son.
John 17:21 That they all may be one; AS (in the same way or fashion) thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, EVEN AS (in the same way or fashion) we are one:
23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Just as "small_creation" stated in her excellent post (Post #3), that she and her husband are one; one in trust, one in commitment; one in secrets shared; one in relationship.
Beautifully and wonderfully put.
_____________________________
The most profound thing I learned in scripture is -
That God, who knows me best -
Loves me anyway.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:15:03 PM
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armydude
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Very beautifully and very wonderfully put. But in your haste to prove your point you missed something. I'll point it out to you. I'm going to put part of this in bold to help you see it.
quote:
John 17:21 That they all may be one; AS (in the same way or fashion) thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. Note that's one IN us not one WITH us. Big difference.
I and the Father are one is a whole different statement than "May they be one in us." When Jesus said that He was saying that we need to be united. That's something we've failed in doing as a church. It has nothing to do with His deity or lack thereof.
_____________________________
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:18:00 PM
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Abishua
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quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
Saying the Son of God was the same as saying "God" in that culture. They understood that.
That is not true. Was Solomon God? Was Adam God? Are the angels God(s)? Of couse not, but they were given the title Son(s) of God.
To take this a step further...."god" is a title that many men in Scripture were given. Moses and the King of Babylon to name just two.
Our definition of "God" today is different than it was back in the day. If I were to say that I met the President, would you immediately think I met the President of the USA? I could simply have meant the President of the local bank. Two persons of power...but one cannot be compared to the other.
The word "god" is translated from the Hebrew root word El. The word El means mighty/powerful one. From that root word we also get Elohim, which is the plural of El.
Elohim (as well as El) is a title given to the Almighty, but not all those with the title "Elohim" are the Almighty God.
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
Scripture please?
One of many......Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:24:00 PM
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benelchi
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quote:
Jesus was not claiming diety when he said "before Abraham was, I am.
That's not what the Jews thought who heard him. This statement by Jesus is quoted in Jn. 8:58 and in 8:59 it records the response of the Jews who were listening i.e. they picked up stones to stone him!
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:30:59 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
Jesus was not claiming diety when he said "before Abraham was, I am.
That's not what the Jews thought who heard him. This statement by Jesus is quoted in Jn. 8:58 and in 8:59 it records the response of the Jews who were listening i.e. they picked up stones to stone him!
Exactly - like my first post in this thread noted - they perfectly knew what Jesus was stating/claiming.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:36:53 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: theo_book
Beautifully and wonderfully put.
For an incorrect view of Jesus? Sure, it was nicely put. Seeing that you want to focus on John chapter 10 where Jesus said in verse 30, “I and the Father are one.” I want to repeat again that at first glance, this might not seem to be a claim to be God.
However, look at the Jews’ reaction to His statement, “We are not stoning you for any of these, replied the Jews, but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God” (John 10:33).
The Jews understood Jesus’ statement to be a claim to be God. In the following verses, Jesus never corrects the Jews by saying, “I did not claim to be God.” That indicates Jesus was truly saying He was God by declaring, “I and the Father are one” (John 10:30).
John 8:58 is another example. Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, before Abraham was born, I am!" Again, in response, the Jews take up stones in an attempt to stone Jesus (John 8:59). Why would the Jews want to stone Jesus if He hadn’t said something they believed to be blasphemous, namely, a claim to be God?
John 1:1 says that “the Word was God.” John 1:14 says that “the Word became flesh.” This clearly indicates that Jesus is God in the flesh. Acts 20:28 tells us, "...Be shepherds of the church of God, which He bought with His own blood." Who bought the church with His own blood? Jesus Christ. Acts 20:28 declares that God purchased the church with His own blood. Therefore, Jesus is God!
Thomas the disciple declared concerning Jesus, “Lord and my God” (John 20:28). Jesus does not correct him. Titus 2:13 encourages us to wait for the coming of our God and Savior - Jesus Christ (see also 2 Peter 1:1). In Hebrews 1:8, the Father declares of Jesus, "But about the Son He says, "Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever, and righteousness will be the scepter of your kingdom."
In Revelation, an angel instructed the Apostle John to only worship God (Revelation 19:10). Several times in Scripture Jesus receives worship (Matthew 2:11; 14:33; 28:9,17; Luke 24:52; John 9:38). He never rebukes people for worshiping Him. If Jesus were not God, He would have told people to not worship Him, just as the angel in Revelation had. There are many other verses and passages of Scripture that argue for Jesus’ deity.
The most important reason that Jesus has to be God is that if He is not God, His death would not have been sufficient to pay the penalty for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:2). Only God could pay such an infinite penalty. Only God could take on the sins of the world (2 Corinthians 5:21), die, and be resurrected - proving His victory over sin and death.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:41:42 PM
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theo_book
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quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
Jesus was not claiming diety when he said "before Abraham was, I am.
That's not what the Jews thought who heard him. This statement by Jesus is quoted in Jn. 8:58 and in 8:59 it records the response of the Jews who were listening i.e. they picked up stones to stone him!
The Jews would have stoned Jesus no matter WHAT he said. They feared he was going to take the crowds away from the chief priests, the Pharisees, and the leaders of the Jews, who loved the chief seats in the synagogue. AND it was prophesied that Jesus would die for the people of their nation.
John 11:47 Then gathered the chief priests and the Pharisees a council, and said, What do we? for this man doeth many miracles. 48 If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation. 49 And one of them, named Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all, 50 Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not. 51 And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation; 52 And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad. 53 Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death.
_____________________________
The most profound thing I learned in scripture is -
That God, who knows me best -
Loves me anyway.
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:45:12 PM
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benelchi
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quote:
Elohim (as well as El) is a title given to the Almighty, but not all those with the title "Elohim" are the Almighty God.
Actually this is untrue. When Elohim is used as a title, it always refers to God (the Almighty). In Hebrew there is always a verb noun agreement in number and gender; When Elohim is used as a title i.e. in a form that is known as the majestic plural, it is treated as if it were a singular masculine noun and used with singular masculine verbs. Example in Ge. 1:1 "God created" is "bara elohim" and is here used as a title, if the writer had intended to use it in the generic sense it would have been "bratem elohim" and would have been translated "gods created".
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:46:45 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: theo_book
The Jews would have stoned Jesus no matter WHAT he said. They feared he was going to take the crowds away from the chief priests, the Pharisees, and the leaders of the Jews, who loved the chief seats in the synagogue. AND it was prophesied that Jesus would die for the people of their nation.
Scripture is plain and clear that they specifically were going to stone Him because Jesus claimed to be God.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:54:17 PM
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earthless
Posts: 5401
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are getting their sweaters ready....
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: theo_book
The Jews would have stoned Jesus no matter WHAT he said. They feared he was going to take the crowds away from the chief priests, the Pharisees, and the leaders of the Jews, who loved the chief seats in the synagogue. AND it was prophesied that Jesus would die for the people of their nation.
Scripture is plain and clear that they specifically were going to stone Him because Jesus claimed to be God.
Yep. Good rationalization, however. Just not true.
However, look at the Jews’ reaction to His statement, “We are not stoning you for any of these, replied the Jews, but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God” (John 10:33).
The Jews understood Jesus’ statement to be a claim to be God. In the following verses, Jesus never corrects the Jews by saying, “I did not claim to be God.” That indicates Jesus was truly saying He was God by declaring, “I and the Father are one” (John 10:30).
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:55:02 PM
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benelchi
Posts: 2130
Joined: 9/14/2007
From: California
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: theo_book
The Jews would have stoned Jesus no matter WHAT he said. They feared he was going to take the crowds away from the chief priests, the Pharisees, and the leaders of the Jews, who loved the chief seats in the synagogue. AND it was prophesied that Jesus would die for the people of their nation.
Scripture is plain and clear that they specifically were going to stone Him because Jesus claimed to be God.
Yep. Good rationalization, however. Just not true.
I assume you are commenting on theo_books post?
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RE: DID Jesus claim to be GOD. - 8/2/2008 9:56:02 PM
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armydude
Posts: 15216
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: NC
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: benelchi
quote:
ORIGINAL: armydude
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: theo_book
The Jews would have stoned Jesus no matter WHAT he said. They feared he was going to take the crowds away from the chief priests, the Pharisees, and the leaders of the Jews, who loved the chief seats in the synagogue. AND it was prophesied that Jesus would die for the people of their nation.
Scripture is plain and clear that they specifically were going to stone Him because Jesus claimed to be God.
Yep. Good rationalization, however. Just not true.
I assume you are commenting on theo_books post?
Yes. My apologies earthless. We're in agreement on this one.
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Good question, you think?
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