Live (the band, not the concept) (Full Version)

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Rufas2000 -> Live (the band, not the concept) (7/20/2008 6:41:08 PM)

Live is one of my favorite bands. I was just wondering what the rest of you thought. Besides favorite songs and albums (or not so favorite ones) here are some points to ponder:

first: Live had one really big album (1994's "Throwing Copper") but never really hit it big again. Were they a "one album wonder"? If so, did they deserve to be (from either perspective)? Why were they unable to capitalize on the enormous popularity of "Throwing Copper" (you couldn't avoid the album on mid 90s rock radio, or even top 40 at times)? My personal view is that Live took awhile to follow it up and when they did ("Secret Samdahi") the lyrics were very vague (even for them) and the music wasn't as focused and viceral as it was on "Throwing Copper". Then by the time they followed that up with "The Distance to Here" the mainstream music scene had left them behind and they never adapted (although they tried to incorporate new trends on "V").

second: Live has some very spiritual themes in their lyrics. Some of their songs have a Christian world view but their singer and lyric writer Ed Kowalczyk would certainly not fit the stereotype of evangelical Christian by any stretch although his daddy was a preacher*. Any thoughts?

finally: Live was considered by some critics to be a U2 copycat in terms of having anthematic songs with a self righteous frontman belting out the words. That's probably why I like them. Again, any thoughts?

My personal take on their music:
I liked "Throwing Copper" the best personally. I liked the anthematic statements and especially the soft to loud contrast. Especially when the music would venture out into near chaos then go back down to a whisper. I also enjoy "Birds of Pray" greatly but felt the songs were a bit simple and short. "V" had its moments of glory but also its moments of cheese. The song "Overcome" (from that album) is incredible, especially considering it was released a week after 9/11 (and yes I know they weren't aware of 9/11 when they recorded it). "The Distance to Here" was very enjoyable but didn't age as well as "Throwing Copper" or "Birds of Pray" to me.

All feedback, even negative is welcome. I don't want this to be a fan thread (but if you are a fan, awesome). I'm just curious as to any other strong opinions about their music.

* The statement is not intended to pass judgment on Kowalczyk's Christianity or lack thereof but rather an observation as to how his public & musical persona conforms (or in this case not) to a very strong stereotype.



duderox4lisa -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/20/2008 11:59:43 PM)

Actually, the band has been often confused with being a "Christian" band,
when in fact, Ed Kowalczyk is/was a student of Eastern beliefs, and cringed at the thought his band being considered as "Christian". It's perhaps because their musical and lyrical approach was more like U2, and when people discovered their spiritual themes, they automatically assumed they were Christians.

Which is very strange, a non-Christian, spiritually themed band considered more "Christian" than actual Christian bands who have been accused of sounding shallow and derivative.


Currently listening to the Black Sabbath/Heaven and Hell song "I" on 'The Rules of Hell' radio special. [8D]



Rufas2000 -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/21/2008 1:46:11 AM)

Thanks for the thoughtful post. I know you're normal genre is metal and Live is a little different from that.

quote:

It's perhaps because their musical and lyrical approach was more like U2, and when people discovered their spiritual themes, they automatically assumed they were Christians.


True but people should have known better or at least fans of their work (and to be fair many of them did). Kowalczyk was very clear that he had very eclectic beliefs about spirituality, many of which conflict with the church. There is very little lyrically on "Throwing Copper" that would suggest a Christian world view (and much to suggest otherwise). "The Distance To Here" and "Birds of Pray" have a few lyrics that might suggest Kowalczyk was looking into his daddy's beliefs but Christian band is quite a stretch. So like you I wonder how they got labeled as a Christian band. At least I understand why Creed was labeled that way.

It does point out that Christians need to be careful when labeling a band Christian. Even if, like us, secular music isn't an issue. Being a Christian and believing a band to be the same could lead to more acceptance of the lyrics. When I listen to Maiden (although Nicko is a Christian) or Priest I realize that their lyrics don't necessarily reflect my beliefs. Many of the might (like Maiden's "Revelations") but I don't use them for spiritual guidance. Insight yes, guidance no.

quote:

Which is very strange, a non-Christian, spiritually themed band considered more "Christian" than actual Christian bands who have been accused of sounding shallow and derivative.


Not sure what you're trying to say. Live was mistaken for a Christian band because of their lyrics (or the misunderstanding thereof) and the anthematic presentation of them (thus the U2 comparisons). Christian bands being accused of being shallow and derivative is a musical issue or gripe, or at least I thought so. I'm curious as to what you're trying to compare or what it means for the "shallow & derivatve" Christian bands (which are out there for sure). Also, I've read critiques of Live that say they are derivitive of U2 and a bit or REM. The consensus would not probably be shallow and derivative but more like not very deep and not particularly original. Kind of the same thing but not as bad.

As a fan of metal what do you think of Live? They certainly aren't metal but parts of "Throwing Copper" reach that intensity level. Their other stuff rocks fairly hard also (but only TC truly reaches metal levels of intensity).

Again, thanks for responding.



markb77 -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/21/2008 2:32:05 PM)

I only have the first two albums. I pretty much lost interest after those. I thought Throwing Copper was good, but haven't listened to it in years. Thanks for the post - a good reminder to pull those out and give them a listen.



freakofnature -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/21/2008 3:07:07 PM)

quote:

and cringed at the thought his band being considered as "Christian


Much like the group Chevelle who's lead singer voiced open mic at Ozzfest about 3 or 4 years ago "We aren't a (explecitive) Christian Band!" I'm still trying to find the direct quote, but it the quote was initially credited to Pete Loeffler in Spin Magazine in, I think 2005.



Rufas2000 -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/21/2008 4:17:45 PM)

quote:

I thought Throwing Copper was good, but haven't listened to it in years.


And if you have that then you pretty much have the Live experience. Just about all of the band's strongpoints are there along with cool stuff they never explored again. The one thing I wish it had more of is Kowalczyk's falsetto (it only shows up at the end of "Lightning Crashes", it gets a bigger role in later albums).

Check out "Pillar of Davidson" especially. You know I've loved that song for around 15 years and never thought about the symbolism of David-Son although I knew the song was about spirituality (the false dogma of man in the verses and bridge and the real deal in the chorus).

Thanks for the responses.



stellaluna -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/21/2008 10:55:27 PM)

Live is awesome! [sm=thumbsup.gif]



humbleinspirit -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/22/2008 12:03:58 AM)

I liked there song Selling the Drama even if I am still somewhat confused by some of the lyrics of the song.

Now, didn't they come out with a song a couple of years ago about believing too?



Rufas2000 -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/22/2008 1:09:36 AM)

quote:

Now, didn't they come out with a song a couple of years ago about believing too?


I think you're thinking about the song "Heaven" from 2003's 'Birds of Pray".

But that song is very general, It states emphatically that he believes in God and Heaven but nothing more definite.

Great song though.

quote:

Live is awesome!


Amen sister. But I think we're alone here in that. Live has inspired a little tepid interest with mostly apathy amongst the denizens here. LOL [;)]

Thanks everybody.



duderox4lisa -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/22/2008 1:40:59 AM)

Even though I am a metal fan, I have found Live to be very inspiring. I was into the Throwing Copper album when it came out as well as a few things before. They did a few cool albums after that as well. One song I particularly like is "Dolphins Cry".

I think the point I was trying to make was that Live was considered a
"Christian" band when U2 comparisons abounded in the music press, while
actual Christian bands were accused by the secular press (and even often in the Christian press) of sounding derivative and "pretensious" (sp?); they were trying hard to be something that they were not, that other "secular" bands were succeeding in doing.



Rufas2000 -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/22/2008 2:31:22 AM)

quote:

I think the point I was trying to make was that Live was considered a
"Christian" band when U2 comparisons abounded in the music press, while
actual Christian bands were accused by the secular press (and even often in the Christian press) of sounding derivative and "pretensious" (sp?); they were trying hard to be something that they were not, that other "secular" bands were succeeding in doing.


OK, great point, thanks.



mysaviorloves24 -> RE: Live (the band, not the concept) (7/23/2008 1:13:33 PM)

the only time i listened to them was after Chris Daughtry did their version of "I Walk the Line" , but other than that i haven't really been into them. but i hear they are pretty good



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