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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 6:12:53 PM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
I actually don't have any faith at all in the govt. I just think that the Medicaid and Medicare programs need to be fixed so that people who need the assistance can get it without the huge hassle that it is now.
No faith in the government yet you want their programs fixed...
If you have no faith in the government shouldn't you want the programs stopped since they are not doing the job?
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The constitution even says that people have an inalienable right to life, that would seem to indicate that health care is a right since it does help one live.
When did the Supreme Court make such a ruling?
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So I ask, what's the solution? Many of you who are just nay saying everything...
No, we are saying the government isn't that answer...
John
We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights. That among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
One cannot have life without health care, nor can one be free to pursue happiness if they're sick all the time and not able to pay for health care. 2+2=4
It's not that hard to figure out if you bother to think about it.
When do you plan on telling the those in charge? Though I think you need to really lay this at the feet of the founding fathers, they seem to have dropped the ball and forgot something in the Bill of Rights...
John
When do you plan to actually offer a solution instead of just trying to shoot people down?
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 6:14:06 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
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ORIGINAL: solo_soprano22
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ORIGINAL: Sophie11
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
One cannot have life without health care, nor can one be free to pursue happiness if they're sick all the time and not able to pay for health care. 2+2=4
One also cannot have life without food and shelter, but the last I checked the government wasn't using the tax money to buy caviar and truffles for those on welfare, and neither were they putting them up in multi-million dollar mansions. The government provides health insurance for the poor. Most of the time these people receive the same kind of care that normal middle class Americans get, not the kind of care that the billionaires of the world can get. And either way, even billionaires die. No one so far has been able to purchase immortality.
Where are all the poor people who get the same standard of care as middle class Americans? Maybe I see it differently because of what I've been exposed to in medical ethics. <shrugs> I guess I can't say which "most" is getting, although from what I see, little to none get the same care as the middle class. Is there some evidence that this is true of the poor and their healthcare?
My sister had her two children at Saint Helena Hospital in the Napa Valley and didn't pay a dime... I paid 25K for my one daughter for a routine birth...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 6:15:25 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DenimDiva
Those of you who are opposed to socialized medical care- have you ever used gov't medical care of any type before?
Yep.... I was in the Navy and I wouldn't wish that medical care on my worst enemy...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 6:19:35 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
I actually don't have any faith at all in the govt. I just think that the Medicaid and Medicare programs need to be fixed so that people who need the assistance can get it without the huge hassle that it is now.
No faith in the government yet you want their programs fixed...
If you have no faith in the government shouldn't you want the programs stopped since they are not doing the job?
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The constitution even says that people have an inalienable right to life, that would seem to indicate that health care is a right since it does help one live.
When did the Supreme Court make such a ruling?
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So I ask, what's the solution? Many of you who are just nay saying everything...
No, we are saying the government isn't that answer...
John
We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights. That among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
One cannot have life without health care, nor can one be free to pursue happiness if they're sick all the time and not able to pay for health care. 2+2=4
It's not that hard to figure out if you bother to think about it.
When do you plan on telling the those in charge? Though I think you need to really lay this at the feet of the founding fathers, they seem to have dropped the ball and forgot something in the Bill of Rights...
John
When do you plan to actually offer a solution instead of just trying to shoot people down?
When people are serious and not trying to squeeze health care out of the The Declartion of Independence...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 6:34:05 PM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
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What makes you think I'm not quite serious in my interpretation of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?
I'm of the opinion that you don't actually have any ideas for a real solution of your own. So you just shoot down anything that's contrary to the status quo, after all it's always been that way. Why try to change it?
At least that's what appears to be your position.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 6:38:21 PM
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relady
Posts: 961
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Greater St. Louis Metro
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Then on the other hand you see more need and less help all the time and you say the church is useless and help would never happen if left up to the church. Hmmm. Historically the church has not stepped up to the plate and delivered the needed services in any amount close to adequate. So while they aren't completely useless -- and I never said they were -- they cannot carry the entire load. They don't have the financial clout nor the centralized organization to do so. The government does, even if it's not the most efficient way to do things.
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Yep.... I was in the Navy and I wouldn't wish that medical care on my worst enemy... I was a Navy dependent, had my child in a Navy hospital and the care overall was more than adequate. I have very few complaints about the medical care available to me as a dependent. My husband might have a different story but he's never said he didn't feel he got good care. It's just that when you are a member, your ability to take off work for needed care can be....difficult. I take it you did not have your children while in the Navy?
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 9:33:49 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
What makes you think I'm not quite serious in my interpretation of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?
Because it doesn't have no real bearing on the matter... The people that wrote document didn't believe the government was cure for much of anything, and generally feared the type of government that you desire... They believe in just enough government to get the job done...
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I'm of the opinion that you don't actually have any ideas for a real solution of your own. So you just shoot down anything that's contrary to the status quo, after all it's always been that way. Why try to change it?
At least that's what appears to be your position.
My position is that the government is not the solution... I don't shoot down anything... I shoot down the call for the government to provide health care...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 9:38:09 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
Historically the church has not stepped up to the plate and delivered the needed services in any amount close to adequate. So while they aren't completely useless -- and I never said they were -- they cannot carry the entire load. They don't have the financial clout nor the centralized organization to do so. The government does, even if it's not the most efficient way to do things.
What about family? Nah... No deep pockets there either... No matter what we end up at the government since they have the means, well actually they don't but let's ignore that and push for it anyways...
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was a Navy dependent, had my child in a Navy hospital and the care overall was more than adequate. I have very few complaints about the medical care available to me as a dependent. My husband might have a different story but he's never said he didn't feel he got good care. It's just that when you are a member, your ability to take off work for needed care can be....difficult. I take it you did not have your children while in the Navy?
Medical care in the Navy was a joke... My wife almost went blind because of their type of care, her dad was in the Navy... I wouldn't have a family while in the military, too hard...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 9:41:29 PM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
What makes you think I'm not quite serious in my interpretation of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?
Because it doesn't have no real bearing on the matter... The people that wrote document didn't believe the government was cure for much of anything, and generally feared the type of government that you desire... They believe in just enough government to get the job done...
quote:
I'm of the opinion that you don't actually have any ideas for a real solution of your own. So you just shoot down anything that's contrary to the status quo, after all it's always been that way. Why try to change it?
At least that's what appears to be your position.
My position is that the government is not the solution... I don't shoot down anything... I shoot down the call for the government to provide health care...
John
So basicly you have no solution. Got it. At least wanting to fix Medicaid and Medicare is a workable solution.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 10:00:59 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
So basicly you have no solution. Got it.
Keeping the government out is a solution against having things getting worse....
Btw.... Your call for the government to be the provider tells me you have no real solution... You don't even want the church to do its part...
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At least wanting to fix Medicaid and Medicare is a workable solution.
Says who? You might as well say that launching yourself into space is workable solution for getting to Pluto... You want what is broke to fix itself... You might as welll stand next to your flat tire and believe it will suck in the air it needs and patch itself...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/23/2008 10:36:03 PM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
So basicly you have no solution. Got it.
Keeping the government out is a solution against having things getting worse....
Btw.... Your call for the government to be the provider tells me you have no real solution... You don't even want the church to do its part...
quote:
At least wanting to fix Medicaid and Medicare is a workable solution.
Says who? You might as well say that launching yourself into space is workable solution for getting to Pluto... You want what is broke to fix itself... You might as welll stand next to your flat tire and believe it will suck in the air it needs and patch itself...
John
Yet another gross mischaracterization of what I've said. I never said I don't want the church to do it's job, I said that the church DOESN'T do it's job. There's a fairly clear difference between the two.
Medicaid and Medicare can be fixed. It's likely to be a difficult process but it is possible.
All you do is nay say talk to down to people. What actual, workable solution do YOU suggest? If you can't step up and help then step aside and let the people who actually want to fix the problem figure it out.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 12:43:19 AM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Yet another gross mischaracterization of what I've said. I never said I don't want the church to do it's job, I said that the church DOESN'T do it's job. There's a fairly clear difference between the two.
Your constant calling for the government tells me you don't want the church involved...
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Medicaid and Medicare can be fixed. It's likely to be a difficult process but it is possible.
They were DOA so what makes you believe they can be fixed?
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All you do is nay say talk to down to people.
Talk about the pot calling the kettle, black....
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What actual, workable solution do YOU suggest? If you can't step up and help then step aside and let the people who actually want to fix the problem figure it out.
I am stepping up to keep socialism out of this country... Keeping the government out of health is a solution to a problem...
For that matter my posting here isn't stopping you or anyone from fixing the problem and I doubt your posting here is going to exact the change you desire... You could alway take one posters idea and just beat the money out of the rich...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 3:36:27 AM
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drnick
Posts: 161
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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I don't think there is a solution that would be acceptable to the US population.
Private health provision by definition has profit at the heart, and therefore will never be adequate - some will invariably be unable to afford it, and thus be excluded (so much for equality).
Goverment provided healthcare has a habit of being over-managed, rationed, and although everyone gets something, there will be areas that are not covered (eg. fertility issues) and new developments will be adopted slowly (eg. new cancer treatements).
Plus, most of you guys would start screaming that the commies are back if the goverment took over healthcare.
A slightly different method would be goverment commissioned healthcare, still tax-funded, but the provision comes from elsewhere.
The UK are trying this, and making a mess of it (far too much cost-cutting).
Sweden have a very good all-encompassing system, but the taxes reflect it, and the US would never buy into it.
There is no perfect solution, but the current US mess is a very good example of how not to do it, IMHO.
_____________________________
Who needs new music. Everyone knows Rock attained perfection in 1974. -- Homer Simpson
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 10:16:26 AM
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mapachito13
Posts: 1819
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
What makes you think I'm not quite serious in my interpretation of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?
Because it doesn't have no real bearing on the matter... The people that wrote document didn't believe the government was cure for much of anything, and generally feared the type of government that you desire... They believe in just enough government to get the job done...
quote:
I'm of the opinion that you don't actually have any ideas for a real solution of your own. So you just shoot down anything that's contrary to the status quo, after all it's always been that way. Why try to change it?
At least that's what appears to be your position.
My position is that the government is not the solution... I don't shoot down anything... I shoot down the call for the government to provide health care...
John
So basicly you have no solution. Got it. At least wanting to fix Medicaid and Medicare is a workable solution.
You got that right! The people that complain the most NEVER offer solutions! Complaining is a hobby for them.
If we as a nation concentrated more on solving our problems than on the problem itself we would get somewhere but politicians, and a lot of Americans it seems, feel they have to have 100% of our backing before they move forward. A legacy of politicians in the last 50 years!
Biblically, we are to care for the sick. Whether this is done through a government program that is already set up (my first choice) or a church program (which would be as fragmented as the church is itself) something must be done to address this problem.
If we turn our income tax into a consumption tax or supplement it with a minor national sales tax of 1-2% (sorry Oregon) we would have the funds to tackle this issue but everyone wants it solved but no one (especially in these days of tight budgets) wants to pay for it!
My biggest beef with pro-lifers is that they will go to great lengths to save the babies of the poor but God forbid we give those same babies medical care AFTER they are born!!! Shouldn't we be doing both???
_____________________________
Three Nails to protect us!
And Justice for all!
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 10:52:55 AM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Yet another gross mischaracterization of what I've said. I never said I don't want the church to do it's job, I said that the church DOESN'T do it's job. There's a fairly clear difference between the two.
Your constant calling for the government tells me you don't want the church involved...
quote:
Medicaid and Medicare can be fixed. It's likely to be a difficult process but it is possible.
They were DOA so what makes you believe they can be fixed?
quote:
All you do is nay say talk to down to people.
Talk about the pot calling the kettle, black....
quote:
What actual, workable solution do YOU suggest? If you can't step up and help then step aside and let the people who actually want to fix the problem figure it out.
I am stepping up to keep socialism out of this country... Keeping the government out of health is a solution to a problem...
For that matter my posting here isn't stopping you or anyone from fixing the problem and I doubt your posting here is going to exact the change you desire... You could alway take one posters idea and just beat the money out of the rich...
John
Alright then I'll ask this again. How are poor people supposed to pay for health care? If they can't afford health insurance in the first place and the church doesn't do it's job where are they supposed to go for help? I asked this before and you just dodged the question so I'm asking again.
The impression that I get is that you'd rather they be sued into poverty or that if they can't pay they just shouldn't get the care.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 11:46:56 AM
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whos_your_dolly
Posts: 75
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: backrowbaptist
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ORIGINAL: mapachito13
There is a problem in this country where people can not have access to healthcare mainly because they are poor. Health insurance is so high that even many people who work forgo it. At some time in everyone's life you are going to have to go to the doctor. This usually involves a trip to the emergency room because that is the only avenue that is available - overloading that very valuable resource.
If people or their children don't have access to healthcare we can risk these sicknesses developing into possibly worse communicable diseases putting the rest of us at risk so a healthy poulation benefits us all and our kids in school.
So the question remains. How can we give access to healthcare for all to fulfill the command Jesus gave us to care for the ill (Matthew 25:36) be it socialized healthcare or another solution? How about focusing on the solution instead of the problem?
As I see it the problem is lack of understanding or truthfullness regarding the problem. When you state that people in this country don't have access to health care, you are either mis-informed, misled or are not being honest. Everybody has access to health care regardless of their ability to pay. It's the law. Some people don't have access to health insurance, mostly because they don't need or want it. But the advocates of socialized medicine are so bound to their rhetoric that they can't see how unnecessary (and dangerous) socialized medicine is.
The problem seems to ME to be a lack of information on your part. You say there are no uninsured people? Or are you saying that even if someone doesn't have insurance they can receive healthcare? Doctors can refuse to treat patients that can't pay. Hospitals are turning away uninsured people at their ERs, poor or inappropriate medical care often is given someone with limited or no coverage. There is DEFINITELY a tremendous problem for people of limited means in this country... not only in obtaining healthcare, but in paying for needed medications and treatments when they are fortunate enough to see a physician. The statement that people don't have insurance because they don't need or want it is ridiculous. You must live in a bubble--- a very elegant bubble I would suspect.
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 11:56:54 AM
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mapachito13
Posts: 1819
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline
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If we go to a heartless pay as you go system for the poor they are denied healthcare. The hospitals would become credit companies. Bring your tax returns and FICO score before we treat you and you are denied treatment for inability to pay. You can't afford 25K for a baby, have it at home and let your friends help!
But look on the bright side! The hospitals will always be in the black and the wait in the ER will be a lot shorter. Of course, people who might have minor sicknesses that could turn into serious communicable diseases will go untreated putting the general population at risk. But, hey, a small price to pay for sound fiscal management.
BTW, those that think it's just a "church problem" haven't honored us with their "insightful and realistic" plans on how this would work!
_____________________________
Three Nails to protect us!
And Justice for all!
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 11:59:16 AM
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whos_your_dolly
Posts: 75
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Yet another gross mischaracterization of what I've said. I never said I don't want the church to do it's job, I said that the church DOESN'T do it's job. There's a fairly clear difference between the two.
Your constant calling for the government tells me you don't want the church involved...
quote:
Medicaid and Medicare can be fixed. It's likely to be a difficult process but it is possible.
They were DOA so what makes you believe they can be fixed?
quote:
All you do is nay say talk to down to people.
Talk about the pot calling the kettle, black....
quote:
What actual, workable solution do YOU suggest? If you can't step up and help then step aside and let the people who actually want to fix the problem figure it out.
I am stepping up to keep socialism out of this country... Keeping the government out of health is a solution to a problem...
For that matter my posting here isn't stopping you or anyone from fixing the problem and I doubt your posting here is going to exact the change you desire... You could alway take one posters idea and just beat the money out of the rich...
John
Alright then I'll ask this again. How are poor people supposed to pay for health care? If they can't afford health insurance in the first place and the church doesn't do it's job where are they supposed to go for help? I asked this before and you just dodged the question so I'm asking again.
The impression that I get is that you'd rather they be sued into poverty or that if they can't pay they just shouldn't get the care.
Medicaid is only problematic because it isnt being policed at the administrative state level. The regulations for many Medicaid programs have been well thought out and manageable in the past. It has only been since the states have started inventing more and more ways to misdirect the funds received into the administrative sector to the detriment of delivery of services to its clients.
The state agencies [public and private] are a greedy bunch and need to be shut down when they are shown to be misusing federal and state funds to buff up their ridiculous top heavy excuses for agencies.
The private and for profit agencies in our state are WORSE yet than the state funded agencies which are themselves horrendous. With less corrupt administrative layers --- or better yet NO administrative layers-- the programs as originally designed could work efficiently. This of course is only about the millionth time Ive said this.
In 1974 HEW's studies of itself showed it would have been cheaper to just give $6000 a year to every person over 18 in the US no questions asked, than it was to administer the welfare program at that time. Over 90% of the funding was being spent on administration. And that was in 1974. They could probably give everyone $100,000 across the board today and just trash all the administrative layers, and STILL be far ahead of the way things are done now.
No private sector is going to do anything other than figure out new and more devious ways to make more and more of a profit regardless of what their supposedly delivering... be it a health care option or whatever. Thats the nature of private enterprise. They are certainly in no way charities, and seldom have any real commitment to whomever their customers are, but are simply trying to make more bucks for doing as little as possible. Show me ONE private industry that does NOT operate in that manner.
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 1:26:26 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
You got that right! The people that complain the most NEVER offer solutions! Complaining is a hobby for them.
The only <cough> solutuion offered here is the government... Btw... Who is complaining the most? Those who want others to pay for their health care...
quote:
If we as a nation concentrated more on solving our problems than on the problem itself we would get somewhere but politicians, and a lot of Americans it seems, feel they have to have 100% of our backing before they move forward. A legacy of politicians in the last 50 years!
Nice slogan...
quote:
Biblically, we are to care for the sick. Whether this is done through a government program that is already set up (my first choice) or a church program (which would be as fragmented as the church is itself) something must be done to address this problem.
Where do the families come into play? Why isn 't the family obligated somewhere in the mix?
quote:
If we turn our income tax into a consumption tax or supplement it with a minor national sales tax of 1-2% (sorry Oregon) we would have the funds to tackle this issue but everyone wants it solved but no one (especially in these days of tight budgets) wants to pay for it!
The people who don't want to pay for it are those complaing they have to pay for their health care and they use the poor as a tool...
quote:
My biggest beef with pro-lifers is that they will go to great lengths to save the babies of the poor but God forbid we give those same babies medical care AFTER they are born!!! Shouldn't we be doing both???
And I am supposed to believe those who have no trouble with the cold blooded murder of the unborn care about anyone else but themselves? Sure thing... I may stop laughing by lunch...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 1:37:25 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Alright then I'll ask this again. How are poor people supposed to pay for health care? If they can't afford health insurance in the first place and the church doesn't do it's job where are they supposed to go for help? I asked this before and you just dodged the question so I'm asking again.
I am for the Fix the Health Care plan... You'll find it right next to idea of fixing the government's plan on the isle marked Socialist Pipe Dreams... Because really this isn't health care for the poor, but a debate on socialism... Health care is just an easy target because people's emotions can be twisted without much effort...
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The impression that I get is that you'd rather they be sued into poverty or that if they can't pay they just shouldn't get the care.
How does one sue one already in poverty into poverty? Where have I said nobody should get care? This is why I don't take what you post seriously...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 1:43:19 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 3404
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
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ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Yet another gross mischaracterization of what I've said. I never said I don't want the church to do it's job, I said that the church DOESN'T do it's job. There's a fairly clear difference between the two.
Your constant calling for the government tells me you don't want the church involved...
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Medicaid and Medicare can be fixed. It's likely to be a difficult process but it is possible.
They were DOA so what makes you believe they can be fixed?
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All you do is nay say talk to down to people.
Talk about the pot calling the kettle, black....
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What actual, workable solution do YOU suggest? If you can't step up and help then step aside and let the people who actually want to fix the problem figure it out.
I am stepping up to keep socialism out of this country... Keeping the government out of health is a solution to a problem...
For that matter my posting here isn't stopping you or anyone from fixing the problem and I doubt your posting here is going to exact the change you desire... You could alway take one posters idea and just beat the money out of the rich...
John
Alright then I'll ask this again. How are poor people supposed to pay for health care? If they can't afford health insurance in the first place and the church doesn't do it's job where are they supposed to go for help? I asked this before and you just dodged the question so I'm asking again.
The impression that I get is that you'd rather they be sued into poverty or that if they can't pay they just shouldn't get the care.
Medicaid is only problematic because it isnt being policed at the administrative state level. The regulations for many Medicaid programs have been well thought out and manageable in the past. It has only been since the states have started inventing more and more ways to misdirect the funds received into the administrative sector to the detriment of delivery of services to its clients.
The state agencies [public and private] are a greedy bunch and need to be shut down when they are shown to be misusing federal and state funds to buff up their ridiculous top heavy excuses for agencies.
The private and for profit agencies in our state are WORSE yet than the state funded agencies which are themselves horrendous. With less corrupt administrative layers --- or better yet NO administrative layers-- the programs as originally designed could work efficiently. This of course is only about the millionth time Ive said this.
In 1974 HEW's studies of itself showed it would have been cheaper to just give $6000 a year to every person over 18 in the US no questions asked, than it was to administer the welfare program at that time. Over 90% of the funding was being spent on administration. And that was in 1974. They could probably give everyone $100,000 across the board today and just trash all the administrative layers, and STILL be far ahead of the way things are done now.
No private sector is going to do anything other than figure out new and more devious ways to make more and more of a profit regardless of what their supposedly delivering... be it a health care option or whatever. Thats the nature of private enterprise. They are certainly in no way charities, and seldom have any real commitment to whomever their customers are, but are simply trying to make more bucks for doing as little as possible. Show me ONE private industry that does NOT operate in that manner.
The federal government isn't a charity and has no real commitment to whomever their customers are and only works to serve itself...
John
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RE: Socialized Medical Care - 7/24/2008 1:57:39 PM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
Status: offline
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