|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 7:34:08 AM
|
|
|
Lizahana
Posts: 1072
Joined: 4/20/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
Well, maybe now YOU were given it in the services and did not like it, but to those without any health insurance, 45-47 million Americans without health insurance - I'm sure they would take it- my neighbor would.
Who knows I had to work 16+ hours a day for less than minimum wage...
quote:
What, then, is your solution, John, to the 45-47 million Americans without health insurance? What is your solution to rising drug and services costs? What is your solution to the hard working people that have to sell their house to pay for medical costs?
Not the government...
quote:
BTW, Obama is not advocating a single payer system for health insurance - only Nader is. And, you're right - Obama is not gold - whatever that means!
Sorry for the typo... Obama is ungodly, heretic, heathen, wicked, murderer, etc.... Is that clear enough?
John
John, some people do work 16+ hours a day in part-time employment because of the ailing economy and job market we have now - you do know what that means right? Part-time = no benefits = no health insurance coverage. So, what is your solution to these people, who have families to support?
And I see your handing out judgements again - does your house have pearly white gates as well?
Peace and God bless,
< Message edited by Lizahana -- 6/27/2008 7:40:26 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 2:48:35 PM
|
|
|
whos_your_dolly
Posts: 87
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
God's will in that individual's LIFE, not in general, John.
He doesn't have one for everything and everyone and another when man throws Him a curve... There is His declared will and His secretive will...
quote:
You think disobedience to God doesn't thwart God's will for your life? [I mean the universal you, not you personally, although the personal you applies to each of us too.. not just a personal accusation is what I mean here].
No... And I mean that for the universal me, me personally and if I am ever on Mars as well...
quote:
I know He doesn't give up and comes about His purposes and His will no matter what we do as He is soverign. BUT we CAN cause our own bumps in the road and pitfalls if we disobey Him. Sometimes He leaves us down there for quite awhile too. Remember Jonah? Maybe thwart was a poor choice of words, but God's will for us is not forced down our throats, it has and always will entail our obedience to it.
God will is backed by the power that created all things and raised Christ from the dead... It's not bound by the whiims of man... The collective will of every person ever born couldn't move God's hand...
His word doesn't return void....
John
SIGH
God's will is backed by GOD. Whims of men can certainly get them OUT of God's will for them. Not permanently hopefully. I know when I have been out of God's will... not hard to figure out if you know God at all.. and Im not saying you don't .....
You are so snide and nasty to people John, what put that big stumbling block on your shoulder anyhow?
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 3:04:14 PM
|
|
|
whos_your_dolly
Posts: 87
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
Well, maybe now YOU were given it in the services and did not like it, but to those without any health insurance, 45-47 million Americans without health insurance - I'm sure they would take it- my neighbor would.
Who knows I had to work 16+ hours a day for less than minimum wage...
quote:
What, then, is your solution, John, to the 45-47 million Americans without health insurance? What is your solution to rising drug and services costs? What is your solution to the hard working people that have to sell their house to pay for medical costs?
Not the government...
quote:
BTW, Obama is not advocating a single payer system for health insurance - only Nader is. And, you're right - Obama is not gold - whatever that means!
Sorry for the typo... Obama is ungodly, heretic, heathen, wicked, murderer, etc.... Is that clear enough?
John
OBAMA is a MURDERER??? who did he murder? That's a pretty dangerous accusation John. And by the way, every man is ungodly, heathen, wicked, heretic, etc. without the saving grace of Jesus. Even David who was much loved by God was an adulterer and murderer and even had the audacity to dance naked before Him... the NERVE !! LOL !! God is SOOO much bigger than Obama or David or you or me or anyone, and He uses whoever He wants to use to do whatever He wants them to do. So if He could use David [that scoundrel  ], He can use Obama too, or anybody else that ends up in the whitehouse or the senate, or anywhere. But since He is so far beyond human comprehension, its impossible to know really WHAT He is doing or HOW He is working. I bet He smiles to Himself alot !! Sort of like we smile at our kids when they do or say something that tickles us. He looks at us with affection just the same yet with infinitely greater tenderness and affection than we are capable of.
< Message edited by whos_your_dolly -- 6/27/2008 3:10:37 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 4:00:56 PM
|
|
|
PaleHawkWoman
Posts: 501
Joined: 7/14/2005
Status: offline
|
Furnituremaker, if you are referring to Medicaid/Medicare as the Socialized Healthcare that picks up when private insurance coverage is exhausted, you'd be mostly wrong.
Medicare covers only those elderly on Social Security income and does not cover many treatments and mediciations, nor does it cover more than a prescribed number of regular visits per year to a physician or specialist, only covers hospital stays up to 60 days or rehabilitation/therapy stays of up to 30 days. It does not cover all treatments, either.
Medicaid covers ONLY children under the age of 19 who are in grade/middle/high school, up to 21 if in college and within income guidelines, pregnant women who are either unmarried or whose spouses make below 130% of the Federal Poverty Standard Index, and single parents on AFDC(if the other parent is in the home, it is considered an intact household and eligibility is terminated). This is per Federal program standards. Some states may have their own programs but have to pay for it themselves, meaning tax revenues are collected to pay for state programs. Coverage eligibility differs from state to state for each program and there is usually a monthly premium starting at about of $40/month charged to the household for coverage to continue. Again, this is not available to those who do not meet poverty-level income standards.
Married couples or intact households can qualify for medicaid only if the household meets AFDC eligibility requirements: the primary wage earner must have worked consistantly for 5 yrs and have become unemployed at least 30 days prior to the application date, or one of the adults in the household is receiving SS DI or SSI income.
Single adults without minor children and married adults are not eligible for Medicaid unless the state they reside in has its own program and pays for it via tax revenue. Income limits still apply.
Medicaid will cover only a prescribed number of office visits, treatments and medications, and length of hospital stays. It will not cover vision, dental, or behavioral treatments/medications for adults. It is far from being a catch-all or safety-net when private insurance is exhausted. You can only apply for it after said private insurance has been exhausted, must provide proof in writing from the insuance company that benefits are exhausted, and coverage- if you are deemed eligible- will only start with the application date so there may be a gap in coverage. Depending on your past year's income and resources(either earned or sold, and including dividend and interest income), you may have to meet a spendown amount of unpaid medical bills before Medicaid kicks in andyou will still be responsible to pay for that spendown amount yourself. If your income/resources are over program limits, you will not be eligible for Medicaid even if your private insuance coverage has been exhausted. And let me tell you, those income/resources limits are extremely low! You basically have to be among the poorest of the poor to be eligible.
Also, Medicaid eligiblity DOES NOT take your living expenses into account. You do not get credit for your mortgage or rent, your utility bills, car note, or insurance premiums. You do not get credit for college or private school tuitions you pay, either. You do not get credit for bankruptcy payments garnished from your income, even if all you get from your paycheck is $1 or less.
Most adults and families do not qualify for Medicaid. Most small employers do not offer health benefits, and many large employers only offer full-time employees(generally management level or above for retailers or service induatry) or offer only access so that the employee has to pay the full premium out-of-pocket, which usually ranges from $450-$750 per month for family coverage. Given the high costs of living expenses, daycare, and transportation, most workers can't afford that kind of expense for health insurance. If you have a chronically ill or disabled family member the HMO generally will not cover them because of "pre-existing" conditions. Said family member may not be eligible for Medicaid due to income over program limits or state medicaid coverage due to access to private health coverage, altho most states providing state medicaid will allow the exemption with proof of ineligiblity from the HMO as long as the household meets income/resources eligibility.
You would need to contact the Department of Human Services in your given state to find out what Medicaid programs are offered and what the eligibility guidelines are. As with all government bureacracies, be prepared to wait 30-90 days from your application date to find out if you qualify.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 4:20:43 PM
|
|
|
mapachito13
Posts: 2510
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: online
|
I know I'm jumping in this frying pan late (and it's already white hot)  and maybe what I am about to say has already been said but I think we better find a solution to insuring these people without insurance BEFORE they become a strain on an already overtaxed emergency room system.
The large majority of the 47 million plus uninsured (80 percent) are native or naturalized citizens. (Source) Where will they go when they need medical care? The emergency room. So 80% of the problem of our emergency rooms are American that can't afford insurance or who are not covered by an employer due to being PT or working for too small a company. Too many ER's and trauma centers have closed their doors due to lack of being reimbursed for services rendered.
This problem is not just going to go away. It needs to be addressed; the sooner, the better!
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 8:25:08 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
Now, I asked you what your solution is - please stop dodging the question.
My solution is not to let the government be involved... Please stop bearing false wittness against me because you don't like my answer...
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 8:30:37 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
John, some people do work 16+ hours a day in part-time employment because of the ailing economy and job market we have now - you do know what that means right? Part-time = no benefits = no health insurance coverage. So, what is your solution to these people, who have families to support?
Not the goverment...
quote:
And I see your handing out judgements again - does your house have pearly white gates as well?
I don't have the millstone of 48,000,000 dead children around my neck like the man you support for president does... Judgment is called for, since I don't have a desire to sit under false teaching(like Obama) and or support the cold blooded murder of the unborn, like Obama... If I didn't rightly judge those things who know I could be voting for such a person come November... So by all means speak loudly of those millions without insurance and think your words have any meaning in my view...
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 8:32:45 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
You are so snide and nasty to people John, what put that big stumbling block on your shoulder anyhow?
Wrong... I am just not moved by weak arguments...
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 8:37:39 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
OBAMA is a MURDERER??? who did he murder? That's a pretty dangerous accusation John.
The support of and the fact the man from a position of authority ordained by God to deal with evil not perpetrate it in regards to the unborn is complicity regarding their being murdered… I stand by the charge...
And by the way, every man is ungodly, heathen, wicked, heretic, etc. without the saving grace of Jesus.quote:
In the eternal sense, yes but not everyone supports the cold blooded murder of the unborn...
quote:
So if He could use David [that scoundrel ], He can use Obama too, or anybody else that ends up in the whitehouse or the senate, or anywhere.
David faults and all was called a man after God's own heart... And yes God does and will use Obama, but in my opinion more like He used Pharaoh...
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 9:03:24 PM
|
|
|
solo_soprano22
Posts: 2472
Joined: 4/27/2005
From: I'm a Southern girl
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
You are so snide and nasty to people John, what put that big stumbling block on your shoulder anyhow?
Lol.
_____________________________
For God, For Learning, Forever.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 9:08:09 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: solo_soprano22
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
You are so snide and nasty to people John, what put that big stumbling block on your shoulder anyhow?
Lol.
I thought it was funny too... Nothing says I don't have an argument louder than a personal attack...
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:04:23 PM
|
|
|
whos_your_dolly
Posts: 87
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
No... And I mean that for the universal me, me personally and if I am ever on Mars as well...
Just spit out my drink....the Mars thing caught me off guard.
Is John trying to be funny? Nah... he's just bustin my chops !
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:09:52 PM
|
|
|
Lizahana
Posts: 1072
Joined: 4/20/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
Now, I asked you what your solution is - please stop dodging the question.
My solution is not to let the government be involved... Please stop bearing false wittness against me because you don't like my answer...
John
John, I have repeatedly shown that the majority of Americans live in a 100% privatized healthcare system, and that most agree that this is a broken system.
You have come on this thread, one would assume, to offer solutions to this problem, or to advocate the current healthcare climate in the US is agreeable to you. I am simply asking what your solution would be, or, if you think it is agreeable, why this is. It seems that you do not take a position - which is the reason for the questions.
If you think the current healthcare climate in the US - that being that 45-47 million Americans are without heath insurance; that hard working people face bankruptcy to pay for healthcare; that these private clinics, pharmaceautical companies, insurance companies are getting wealthy at the expense of other people's health - if you find that this is a good situation, by all means - please say so.
Or, if you have another solution, please offer it.
Otherwise, why did you come on this thread?
Peace and God bless,
< Message edited by Lizahana -- 6/27/2008 10:20:43 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:12:07 PM
|
|
|
Lizahana
Posts: 1072
Joined: 4/20/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
John, some people do work 16+ hours a day in part-time employment because of the ailing economy and job market we have now - you do know what that means right? Part-time = no benefits = no health insurance coverage. So, what is your solution to these people, who have families to support?
Not the goverment...
quote:
And I see your handing out judgements again - does your house have pearly white gates as well?
I don't have the millstone of 48,000,000 dead children around my neck like the man you support for president does... Judgment is called for, since I don't have a desire to sit under false teaching(like Obama) and or support the cold blooded murder of the unborn, like Obama... If I didn't rightly judge those things who know I could be voting for such a person come November... So by all means speak loudly of those millions without insurance and think your words have any meaning in my view...
John
LOL! John, I am an independent, and do not know whom I'm voting for.
And, I was strictly taught that God does the judging, not us. Obviously you were taught differently and I definitley part ways with that way of thinking.
BTW, if you did not want to hear about the millions without health insurance, why did you even want to come onto this thread? Just curious - generally if you come onto a thread, you offer if you are pro or con to it...
Peace and God bless,
< Message edited by Lizahana -- 6/27/2008 10:45:41 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:13:43 PM
|
|
|
Lizahana
Posts: 1072
Joined: 4/20/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
Wow, there is some ugly rhetoric in here...
"Pearly white gates", "stumbling blocks", "sweetie pie"???? 
Well, perhaps some of us were taught differently. I was taught not to judge - that only God can judge us.
BTW, the person judged Obama as 'wicked' and a murderer. Our justice system would not even allow this - interesting that you are comfortable with this.
Peace and God bless,
< Message edited by Lizahana -- 6/27/2008 10:25:28 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:22:24 PM
|
|
|
solo_soprano22
Posts: 2472
Joined: 4/27/2005
From: I'm a Southern girl
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
Wow, there is some ugly rhetoric in here...
"Pearly white gates", "stumbling blocks", "sweetie pie"????
Why is stumbling block rhetoric? Lots of things in our lives become stumbling blocks for ourselves and for others. People who don't try to reason and don't give others any respect must have some sort of issues don't you think? People who disagree but offer no better idea shouldn't be so categorically dismissive of those they don't agree with. Nobody wants a messed up system of health care, government run or otherwise. But NO solution is the worst of all. I'm against abortion too, but what about those who are allowed to be born, and then can't get the help they need to live a healthy productive life? Isn't that just another twist to the problem we seem to have of nobody really caring about the helpless? Including the government, many many many many individuals, and the church as a whole.
Yeah, sometimes when people disagree here, respect goes out the out the window. 
I think part of the issue in this thread is that some agree that the system is broken, but not all of them necessarily have a solution... yet the solution to them is probably not universal healthcare.
_____________________________
For God, For Learning, Forever.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:33:06 PM
|
|
|
whos_your_dolly
Posts: 87
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: PaleHawkWoman
Furnituremaker, if you are referring to Medicaid/Medicare as the Socialized Healthcare that picks up when private insurance coverage is exhausted, you'd be mostly wrong.
Medicare covers only those elderly on Social Security income and does not cover many treatments and mediciations, nor does it cover more than a prescribed number of regular visits per year to a physician or specialist, only covers hospital stays up to 60 days or rehabilitation/therapy stays of up to 30 days. It does not cover all treatments, either.
Medicaid covers ONLY children under the age of 19 who are in grade/middle/high school, up to 21 if in college and within income guidelines, pregnant women who are either unmarried or whose spouses make below 130% of the Federal Poverty Standard Index, and single parents on AFDC(if the other parent is in the home, it is considered an intact household and eligibility is terminated). This is per Federal program standards. Some states may have their own programs but have to pay for it themselves, meaning tax revenues are collected to pay for state programs. Coverage eligibility differs from state to state for each program and there is usually a monthly premium starting at about of $40/month charged to the household for coverage to continue. Again, this is not available to those who do not meet poverty-level income standards.
Married couples or intact households can qualify for medicaid only if the household meets AFDC eligibility requirements: the primary wage earner must have worked consistantly for 5 yrs and have become unemployed at least 30 days prior to the application date, or one of the adults in the household is receiving SS DI or SSI income.
Single adults without minor children and married adults are not eligible for Medicaid unless the state they reside in has its own program and pays for it via tax revenue. Income limits still apply.
Medicaid will cover only a prescribed number of office visits, treatments and medications, and length of hospital stays. It will not cover vision, dental, or behavioral treatments/medications for adults. It is far from being a catch-all or safety-net when private insurance is exhausted. You can only apply for it after said private insurance has been exhausted, must provide proof in writing from the insuance company that benefits are exhausted, and coverage- if you are deemed eligible- will only start with the application date so there may be a gap in coverage. Depending on your past year's income and resources(either earned or sold, and including dividend and interest income), you may have to meet a spendown amount of unpaid medical bills before Medicaid kicks in andyou will still be responsible to pay for that spendown amount yourself. If your income/resources are over program limits, you will not be eligible for Medicaid even if your private insuance coverage has been exhausted. And let me tell you, those income/resources limits are extremely low! You basically have to be among the poorest of the poor to be eligible.
Also, Medicaid eligiblity DOES NOT take your living expenses into account. You do not get credit for your mortgage or rent, your utility bills, car note, or insurance premiums. You do not get credit for college or private school tuitions you pay, either. You do not get credit for bankruptcy payments garnished from your income, even if all you get from your paycheck is $1 or less.
Most adults and families do not qualify for Medicaid. Most small employers do not offer health benefits, and many large employers only offer full-time employees(generally management level or above for retailers or service induatry) or offer only access so that the employee has to pay the full premium out-of-pocket, which usually ranges from $450-$750 per month for family coverage. Given the high costs of living expenses, daycare, and transportation, most workers can't afford that kind of expense for health insurance. If you have a chronically ill or disabled family member the HMO generally will not cover them because of "pre-existing" conditions. Said family member may not be eligible for Medicaid due to income over program limits or state medicaid coverage due to access to private health coverage, altho most states providing state medicaid will allow the exemption with proof of ineligiblity from the HMO as long as the household meets income/resources eligibility.
You would need to contact the Department of Human Services in your given state to find out what Medicaid programs are offered and what the eligibility guidelines are. As with all government bureacracies, be prepared to wait 30-90 days from your application date to find out if you qualify.
I didn't see furniture maker post that. Maybe he did, but I didn't read it quite like that. I mean I saw him say something about what will you do [not you PERSONALLY, but the generalized "you" ---even on Mars maybe] when your insurance drops you and you have a catastrophic illness or something. I think he was saying that in a way we are all ultimately at the mercy of the state programs if we get sick enough, unless we just go on and die. Or go to Mars.
Lots should qualify for Medicaid and don't , even those who USED to qualify. I worked with adults with MI who were all on Medicaid ... and at that time some were eligible for the Title 19 Waiver, and some not. Those who were not had SSI. Since then I'm afraid some have been cut from the rolls.
Most lived in subsidized housing, got a pittance of food stamps, and paid for everything they needed over and above what the Medical card covered out of the $500 a month they got from SSI. Pretty tough to live on $500 a month. Now its up to $550 I think.
There are some lazy bums out there for sure, but I didn't find that to be the case for the majority of my clients. Some places in this country people like my clients are just thrown out into the streets to fend for themselves and become the homeless. The nasty little problem just never goes away.
The people that REALLY get to me are the ones giving themselves raises and percs while spending most of their time and your tax dollars and mine, messing with the system to capture funds at the administrative level, while screaming POOR and justifying the lopping off from the rolls people who have no other support systems to help them. Does the state capitol REALLY need a gold dome? Does the governor REALLY need gold faucets in his loo? Do agencies HAVE to have pretty new buildings while its clients are being cut off? BLUCK.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:33:40 PM
|
|
|
Sophie11
Posts: 777
Joined: 1/24/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
People who disagree but offer no better idea shouldn't be so categorically dismissive of those they don't agree with. Nobody wants a messed up system of health care, government run or otherwise. But NO solution is the worst of all.
No, not doing anything is better than implementing universal healthcare. Our current system is far superior than that would show itself to be.
Anyway, I disagree with universal healthcare after spending a pretty fair amount of time studying the issue and how it has gone over in other countries. I did not simply "dismiss" the idea without first studying it, and I'm sure it's the same for others here as well. Just because we disagree does not mean I "dismiss" your view, we just have different opinions, that's all.
quote:
ORIGINAL: solo_soprano22
I think part of the issue in this thread is that some agree that the system is broken, but not all of them necessarily have a solution... yet the solution to them is probably not universal healthcare.
You are right! And I don't think someone needs to have an alternative solution either in order to be able to disgree with universal healthcare. I often hear people saying "offer me something better then", and if their philosophy is to accept the best of the worst, then fine. But mine isn't. I don't support something I disagree with simply because it is the only idea available at the time. I will have patience, someone will find a better way. 
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/27/2008 10:55:31 PM
|
|
|
Stronger2day
Posts: 106
Joined: 5/26/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
Wow, there is some ugly rhetoric in here...
"Pearly white gates", "stumbling blocks", "sweetie pie"????
Why is stumbling block rhetoric? Lots of things in our lives become stumbling blocks for ourselves and for others. People who don't try to reason and don't give others any respect must have some sort of issues don't you think? People who disagree but offer no better idea shouldn't be so categorically dismissive of those they don't agree with. Nobody wants a messed up system of health care, government run or otherwise. But NO solution is the worst of all. I'm against abortion too, but what about those who are allowed to be born, and then can't get the help they need to live a healthy productive life? Isn't that just another twist to the problem we seem to have of nobody really caring about the helpless? Including the government, many many many many individuals, and the church as a whole.
It wasn't the phrase 'stumbling blocks', it was the sentiment sent with it. This is a 'moooo' point now (as Joey Tribbiani would say it).
_____________________________
"The journey from your mind to your hands is shorter than you're thinking. Be careful if you think you stand, you just might be sinking."
(Slow Fade/Casting Crowns)
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/28/2008 9:10:16 AM
|
|
|
whos_your_dolly
Posts: 87
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lizahana
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
Wow, there is some ugly rhetoric in here...
"Pearly white gates", "stumbling blocks", "sweetie pie"????
Now WHO said "pearly white gates" ... you talking about BILL ?
That was actually me - I have a tough time with humans judging others - I was taught not to - that only God can judge us. So, I asked John if he lived in a house with pearly white gates.
Peace and God bless,
I'm sorry Liz... I was saying that with a smile but maybe it came across as a criticism. My family has a tendency to be sarcastic in their attempts at humor, and since I was the one who said "stumbling block" I ffigured we were in the same boat ["controversial" phrase wise]and was just needling you in good humor.
Why shouldn't we use phrases like those? We all run upon stumbling blocks in our lives, and I for one can't WAIT to see the "pearly gates". I was accused of sending a negative "sentiment" by using the phrase "stumbling blocks".
I was just sitting here shaking my head in wonder and actually amusement at that quizzical conclusion and decided someone else [the dreaded "pearly gates" perpetrator] was being subtly chastised as well, so decided to commiserize with you.
I agree 100 % and want NO part of judging anyone... Im still working out my OWN way, and trying to help others if I can. I thought I was merely making an observation based on what John was posting in here, not judging him...
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Socialized Medical Care - 6/28/2008 9:15:02 AM
|
|
|
whos_your_dolly
Posts: 87
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
quote:
ORIGINAL: whos_your_dolly
quote:
ORIGINAL: Stronger2day
Wow, there is some ugly rhetoric in here...
"Pearly white gates", "stumbling blocks", "sweetie pie"????
Why is stumbling block rhetoric? Lots of things in our lives become stumbling blocks for ourselves and for others. People who don't try to reason and don't give others any respect must have some sort of issues don't you think? People who disagree but offer no better idea shouldn't be so categorically dismissive of those they don't agree with. Nobody wants a messed up system of health care, government run or otherwise. But NO solution is the worst of all. I'm against abortion too, but what about those who are allowed to be born, and then can't get the help they need to live a healthy productive life? Isn't that just another twist to the problem we seem to have of nobody really caring about the helpless? Including the government, many many many many individuals, and the church as a whole.
It wasn't the phrase 'stumbling blocks', it was the sentiment sent with it. This is a 'moooo' point now (as Joey Tribbiani would say it).
What sentiment did it send with it in your opinion? We can disagree without being hateful and disrespectful can't we? Shouldn't we show respect to and interest in what others in His family think about what He says? Jumping on people and making snide remarks about what they posted isn't productive, or right in my opinion. Disagreeing is fine... after all this is a forum. But just bashing and saying mean things isn't fine.
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Tools
Printable Version
