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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 12:26:48 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 5070
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LaurainAL
When I visit here I get the impression from some that they are Stepford Moms. I don't know any in real life so it is a bit confusing that they exist on the internet.
Hehe. I've only met one Stepford Mom around here  I've seen some very real struggles on this forum from almost all of the regular posters, but if you only read the baby chat thread then I guess you could assume otherwise.
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Ryanne
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 12:44:47 PM
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paulsbride
Posts: 1968
Joined: 5/19/2005
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quote:
I'm still longing for the day when Nathan doesn't feel the need to pull out every pot and pan. OK, he isn't that bad, but still.... I had a small triumph yesterday - he actually attempted to put the pans back! We've been working on "put it back" a lot, but it was the first time I've seen him try to put his "toys" away without my prompting. He got lots of praise.
Aww! Yay! I love hearing what Nathan is doing. Him and Judah are in such similar realms of learning and abilities!
I am working with Judah on picking up any food that ends up on his tray and putting it back on his plate before he can get down from the table. Today he picked up his cheerios all by himself and it made me so proud!
As for the mommy stuff ... I tend to look at life with a very positive outlook. I need to, because I will otherwise be a miserable person to live with (I know this because I live with myself... I am much easier to live with if I'm happy  ) Not just happy, but joyful.
The hard mommy stuff with Judah was never really overwhelmingly bad. When we almost lost him at 19 weeks pregnant (and told we could lose him anytime after that) I had a consistent prayer that God would give me my baby. I think knowing that we almost didn't have him made the nursing issues and the reflux issues and the sleeping issues seem like nothing in light of the fact that I had a living, breathing baby to care for.
There were definitely struggles, but personality wise I'm one of those people who benefit from Ryanne's "pull up your big girl panties" type comments. 
I also, for the most part, avoid responding to "vents" because I am not always the most gracious in how I word things. I would never intend to hurt or discourage another mother, and while I tend to think that focusing on the positive, turning to the Lord with your problems and a good cry in a bubble bath fixes most things I know other women need more gentle words and patience to their frustrations. We're all different. That's what makes us cool 
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-Jessica-
<--- 25 weeks
MY BLOG
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 12:53:38 PM
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manda59
Posts: 5721
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LaurainAL
Manda,
I think posts like this may be what she is referring to.
quote:
Sorry to be so direct but, EmilyAnn, that's what you signed up for when you decided to have a baby.
I think you will find that's probably the only time I've said that, unless my memory isn't serving me well (which happens!)
In any case, I stand by every word.
_____________________________
"I love Manda's suggestion to just laugh most of it off.."
Tinkerbell, September 2008
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 1:11:21 PM
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TwinCityGirl
Posts: 951
Joined: 4/12/2005
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Just fair warning, I might not respond more than this in this thread:
When I was 3 weeks from giving birth to my one and likely only child (I am 42, it took us over 4 years to conceive him), I made a big mistake (in my opinion) and went into the Pregnancy Thread and commented on someone's venting about pregnancy.
Big mistake. I hurt my friend (though I have worked it out and explained it all to her) when my intention was to encourage her.
My BIGGEST mistake, though, was going in that thread AT ALL. I feel that is a very, very good and supportive thread for so many, but when I tried to say that maybe people should be happy about their pregnancies rather than every other post being about sore feet or swollen ankles --- oh MAN did I get CLOBBERED for that. Not by my friend that I had been trying to encourage, but SEVERAL other women decided to pummel me (yes, that is what it felt like) for my insensitivity toward my friend and all the pregnant women, I guess.
All I had wanted to do was tell my friend not to worry. And suddenly I was defending myself from a group of women who (it appeared to me) thought I was evil, and certainly out of touch for trying to say maybe pregnancy is hard but maybe it helps to say good things about it more than bad (self-fulfilling prophecy sometimes?). I'm pretty sure the discussion got too heated before I ever got my real point out.
Like I said, I worked everything out eventually with my friend, and to be honest - BECAUSE SHE WAS MY FRIEND (I sent her a wedding gift when she got married, I have talked to her on the phone, I have sent her something in the mail) I felt I could say this bit of encouragement to her. I felt like we were close enough and she "got me" enough that I could be playfully frank with her. She was at a delicate time in her life (pregnant and at home) and my advice went over like a lead balloon with her.
I am convinced if other people hadn't started pummeling me with how awful I was to talk to her like that that I could have easily explained to my friend what I had meant (she now agrees with me on that).
So I really don't know WHAT to do anymore. Like I said, I had friendship with this woman for 7 years before I made those comments to her on the forums. No, I don't expect other people to know who's friends with whom behind-the-scenes here but I sure would have appreciated SOMEONE giving me the benefit of the doubt without assuming I was just out to attack this woman. I never saw what I said to her as an attack. I was trying to encourage her not to worry.
I don't go back in the Pregnancy Thread because, frankly, after trying for 4.5 years to get pregnant myself, I can't take it. Maybe it's just me, and admittedly I had a GOOD pregnancy -- not perfect, but good. I didn't want to complain about something we had tried to achieve and had prayed for for so long. I have changed my posting habits here since that day. Some really cruel things were said to me and I find myself no longer trusting certain people. I sure would have appreciated being given the benefit of the doubt. I would have thought that ANYBODY that had read my posts over the years would know that I constantly try to be an encourager. It doesn't always pay to be articulate (you get called "blunt" all the time). I've found that what many, many, MANY women here want is for each responder to take 15 minutes to wrap up their post with smiley faces and flowery words. Yes, I have seen harsh things said here to those who are "blunt" in their advice, but sometimes you just don't want to take 15 minutes to be all "You're such a great person, such a great mom, such a great human being, the next Albert Schweitzer, let the baby sleep on her tummy if that's what she wants, you're the best ever, best mom, smiley-smiley."
I don't always have that kind of TIME to do that (nor does anyone else), and sometimes I reeeeeeeeaaaaaalllllllly wish that people would just "get to know" the posters here so that if something strikes someone as "odd" or "blunt" they could just tell themselves "Well, Jeanie must be in a hurry today, she's usually so encouraging", or "I've read Jeanie's last 12 posts to this woman and ALL OF THEM were loving so maybe she means this in a loving way."
For the record, I do have a pretty easy baby, not the world's easiest, but he's pretty easy-going. I do have a heart for first-time moms as they are figuring out how to deal with a higher-needs baby, learning how to cope with being at home almost all the time (loss of mobility), loss of adult companionship as they've quit jobs, loss of having a good hair day, a shower every day, wearing makeup, etc. Going from a working woman to a stay-at-home mom can thrust you right into an identity crisis that is compounded with a baby whose needs you must figure out and then take care of. Yes, that IS what you signed up for when you got pregnant, but I'm convinced NOBODY has a clue the totality of mothering until they are in it themselves. You could be a nanny, a daycare provider, a kindergarten teacher, but until you have that little one who needs YOU and wants YOU and YOU ARE THE WORLD TO HIM -- nobody can be fully prepared for that, and there's no preparation for sitting in your spit-up stained shirt with your kittywampus ponytail and feeling like a total scrub and you haven't had sex in a week and it's 2:30 in the afternoon and you've forgotten to eat all day. NOBODY can prepare you for that in totality those first weeks as you figure out your baby.
I am, of course, AFRAID to post this reply because I know someone is going to let me have it. I guess I'm ready for that. I have started scaling back how often I post because while I do have nice things to say and I do feel I say almost everything NICELY (I can't help how someone perceives it in some cases), sometimes it just does not pay off for me. As a middle-child, encouraging type, I just am running out of thick skins when I have gone out of my way to encourage and am accused of the exact opposite.
There. Have at it. I can probably take it.
Jeanie
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 1:36:12 PM
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LaurainAL
Posts: 1437
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Hi Jeanie. Thanks for the good post and I appreciate your perspective. You bring up a good point. We should give each other the benefit of the doubt sometimes and I think it goes both ways. I can appreciate that you were trying to help your friend in the pregnancy thread and I remember reading it and thinking that it was harsh. But, like you said, I didn't know the history of your relationship. I can also appreciate that I don't know all the ins and outs of a mother's vents. Shouldn't we also try and give the new Mom the benefit of doubt that she is not a bad and uncaring mother because she needs to do something else beside mother for 5 minutes.
Motherhood has not come as easy to me as it appears to have to some of you. I know this is true in real life. All my SIL ever wanted to do and be was a Mom. She just eats every bit of it up. She loves it and is happiest while she is pregnant or tending to a newborn. Me....well not so much. It takes work and I have to war with myself every single day. Don't misunderstand me. I love my kids and would die for them. Just look at my avatar. Aren't they just the cutest? God gave me these children to raise and I am so grateful. But it doesn't come natural to me and I needed real encouragement so that I did not go completely nuts.
I see that we are all coming at this from a different place that's ok too.
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Life Trumps Choice
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 1:44:30 PM
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BlessedMamaofmany
Posts: 1978
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Just north of nowhere
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Honestly Jeanie...when I first read the post you're talking about...I thought you were harsh and uncaring. BECAUSE I DIDN'T KNOW YOU. Now that I DO know you better, I would have viewed that post in a whole different light.
Does that make sense?
That's the trouble with forums, especially ones with A LOT of women. We can get so darned sensitive.
A woman who has a good marriage/pregnancy/baby is bragging.
A woman who has a tough marriage/pregnancy/baby is whiny.
blah blah blah
I think that there comes a point where you have to choose not to be offended. I know for a fact there are many here who don't a agree with the choices I make in my life, but I don't care. I think there are a couple of women here who are drama-queens...but I'd never say who, because what good would that do? (just my opinion of course. I'm sure there are some who think I whine quite a bit..and some days I sure do!) And that certainly doesn't mean I don't like them.
I say what I'm gonna say based on my opinion and life experience. If you (general you) choose to get offended, sorry, that's your choice...however, that doesn't give me license to be cruel in my words. No more than it gives me license to declare another's words as offensive. I don't intend to offend, but I'll certainly not spend my time making sure that what I say isn't offensive to anyone..someone, somewhere will always get bent out of shape.
I for one, like you Jeanie. I think you do such a good job to address certain individual women who are seeking encouragement and giving them uplifting words.
So, that's my story and I'm sticking to it. I love crosswalk, I've made some very very dear friends here. I like the debate and the differences between us.
Sandy
_____________________________
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DustySgt
I  my soldier!
Geico saved 15% by switching to Chuck Norris
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 1:53:11 PM
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myka
Posts: 750
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I just wanted to add that as both an "experienced" mom and new mom (there is a long time between my children-oldest is in high school, youngest is preschool), people tend to 'forget' sometimes how hard and all-consuming parenting a small child is at times.
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:00:54 PM
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LaurainAL
Posts: 1437
Joined: 8/13/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: myka
I just wanted to add that as both an "experienced" mom and new mom (there is a long time between my children-oldest is in high school, youngest is preschool), people tend to 'forget' sometimes how hard and all-consuming parenting a small child is at times.
Yep.
I was a 30 year old professional when my first was born. My pregnancy was great because I was completely ignorant of the hardships of taking care of a new born. My picture was in the dictionary next to the word "clueless". My whole life had been spent in the academic and professional world and then BAM I was at a very unfamiliar and uncomfortable place. My mother had died 2 years prior so I didn't have her to lean on and I was lost. With my second it was both good and bad. It was good in the fact that I knew that eventually one day he *would* sleep all night long and that I *would* get to sleep too. But, my pregnancy was plagued by the dread of knowing that I was going to have to deal with it all over again.
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Life Trumps Choice
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:13:52 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 5070
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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Do you think motherhood is easier for those who want it?
I desired to be a mommy, I knew what I was getting into having nannied a newborn full time(sleepless night and all) but it's still a bit overwhelming at times. I sat in the doctors office and practically sobbed when he told me I had to wake DD to feed her every 2 hours, but to me that was just part of being a mother. I guess I didn't think to be upset about it, or feel the need to vent because I had "signed up" for that duty. I didn't know I was getting a baby with reflux who didn't gain weight, or weekly doctors appointments, or waking every 2 hours to nurse for an hour, nor did I know that Micah was going to work nights thus sleeping during the day and that he wouldn't be able to help. I just had my father's voice in the back of my head that said "cowboy up and take it like a man".
Am I super mom? Certainly not. I don't do as much floor time as I could with her, my college classes take up the majority of my "spare" time, and sometimes I get outright frustrated at the fact that I have to cook 2 separate meals and keep a detailed food journal including food labels. It gets old to miss an ingredient and end up changing diarrhea diapers and being up at all hours of the night for 7-10 days after a "bad food" exposure. But she's my child, I'm her mommy and I'm the one who cares for and loves her the most. God has entrusted her to me knowing that I have the capability of dealing with her needs.
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Ryanne
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:18:49 PM
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LaurainAL
Posts: 1437
Joined: 8/13/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: PrudentWife
(((Laura)))
Until now, I honestly never knew about your experience and feelings about motherhood. I thought you loved being a mom and your frustrations were about other peoples' reactions and comments about your choices.
My experience has been very similar, except that I was also taken away from the familiar (professional world). That in itself was very hard on me. Throw motherhood and a difficult baby in the mix, and I was a proper mess.
Thanks Prudent. I often feel like I'm the only one that feels this way.
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Life Trumps Choice
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:25:33 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10274
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
Status: online
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quote:
Do you think motherhood is easier for those who want it?
I think it can help put things in perspective, not necessarily make it easier though.
My first little darling...well, I was young and stupid. I had just married immaturely and had no support really from Brian at that time. I *had* to work at that time or we would not have eaten. Then I got this medically fragile kid (SO not what ANY mom asks for or expects!)...he had pneumonia over 10 times in his first two years. He has a chest deformity that makes everything settle in his lungs. He almost died more than once. I honestly don't know how I survived those years and every thing from that time is a blur. I'm kind of glad it was a blur.
Fast foward to #2 (well...kid #3, but #2 from my womb and that I get to keep all the time)...we tried for her for around 3 years. Had to have major surgery, which going into I wasn't sure if I would even have a uterus when I came out. Thankfully, I did, and Hannah was conceived post-haste. LOL She was medically fine, but extremely needy all hours of the day. I had the worst PPD I have had with her, though I was never anything but thankful to have her! I firmly believe chronic sleep-deprivation was the big issue with her. I didn't sleep over 3 hours straight for well over a year. But...I had known infertility and the pain of it. I had known how awful it was to have a sick baby and have to leave him in daycare (my daycare provider was okay with me leaving him when I did...and she was an EMT, so I was never worried about him medically there). Those experiences greatly changed who I was and how I looked at things. I don't know if I would have been able to remain sane through Hannah's first 18 months without those things, and I am now THANKFUL to God for giving me those hard times to grow through before He gave me what *I* thought was best at the time.
Wow...that was rambly...sorry...I hope it answered the question though...LOL.
_____________________________
I will praise you, O Lord, among the nations;
I will sing of you among the peoples.
For great is your love, reaching to the heavens;
your faithfulness reaches to the skies.
~Psalm 57:9-10~
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:39:46 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 3225
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: BlessedMamaofmany
Honestly Jeanie...when I first read the post you're talking about...I thought you were harsh and uncaring. BECAUSE I DIDN'T KNOW YOU.
I was in the same boat. I remember thinking that you were using your own pregnancy announcement like a weapon. The wonderful irony of that whole bru hah hah, is that it drew my attention to you more, and I got the opportunity to get to know you better. So, I feel like something good came out of it.
I did appreciate the effort and clarity of your post. Laura is right; we're all coming from different angles here, and that can be a good thing. What comforts one does not comfort another; what strengthens one, does not strengthen another.
I think Myka is right, too. From talking with my own mother, once a certain number of years pass, she tended to forget just how hard it really was. Intellectually she still knew that there was sleep deprivation and the frustration of a husband who couldn't handle a crying baby, but years tend to dull the pain.
Laura, I forgot to ask in the other thread, is it ok to ask how you met your husband? Since it's your anniversary and all.
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:47:06 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 3225
Joined: 4/12/2005
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And speaking of my mother, she arrived here before Nathan woke up from his nap, did the dishes and is now taking Nathan out for walk and a snack at Target. God Bless my mother.
Jessica, this is going to sound odd, but is Judah sleeping more then he used to? Nathan is, and while I am not complaining, it seems a bit odd. We've hit a real sweet spot with him, 11 hours a night and a 2 hour nap during the day. It hasn't always been like this, and I know it won't be like this forever, so I'm enjoying it while I have it.
Just seems weird that he's decided to sleep more then he was a month ago. Maybe it's a growth spurt, maybe his teeth aren't bothering him as much anymore, maybe he's just tired. These days he doesn't walk anymore ... he runs.
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 2:56:28 PM
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TwinCityGirl
Posts: 951
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sideways
quote:
ORIGINAL: BlessedMamaofmany
Honestly Jeanie...when I first read the post you're talking about...I thought you were harsh and uncaring. BECAUSE I DIDN'T KNOW YOU.
I was in the same boat. I remember thinking that you were using your own pregnancy announcement like a weapon. The wonderful irony of that whole bru hah hah, is that it drew my attention to you more, and I got the opportunity to get to know you better. So, I feel like something good came out of it.
What has always been difficult for me is say Woman A is asking for advice, and 8 people give her advice. And Woman B gives her some playfully frank advice "Just do X right now, Woman A, and get on with it." and Woman A is GRATEFUL for that advice, laughs about it and "haha --- yeah, you're right" as a response.
Now you take Woman A again, and it's a different day, different situation she wants advice on. And I'm Woman C. And I remember that in the past Woman A has accepted, laughed along with, and appreciated blunt advice like Woman B gave. So I phrase my response in the same way that Woman B did.
And then I am pounced on.
Whaaaaa??????!!!
So to me it almost gets to the point of not ever feeling "safe" to post anything because Woman B can say whatever she wants/whenever she wants/however she wants and IT IS ACCEPTED. I have seen it before: two women say pretty much the exact same thing and from one it is accepted as gold, the other woman appears to be a villain. What gives?
I'm not even irritated as I say this, but if we can't make it safe for women to respond without feeling of reprisal, we're going to end up with very few people that venture out and give any kind of advice at all.
Yeah, I know that needs and sensitivity varies from day to day for many women here, but if you're going to be Woman A and basically say "All kinds of advice are welcome" by accepting a Woman B response, you lay down the precedent that it's okay to be blunt/haha/playfully frank with you. No fair, then, when Woman C or D approaches you the same way.
It's the old Dr. Phil line (love him or hate him, it's a true statement) "You teach people how to treat you."
Again I go back to that we need to give each other the benefit of the doubt. I have also seen something really great here before where some women (who are particularly skilled at this, I believe) will try to draw out someone's advice-asking post more for clarity, or try to draw out someone's possibly-confusing answer so that it IS understood in the proper way. People that do this are my heroes. Rather than assuming Woman C meant harm they ask for clarity in a non-threatening way and ASSUME that Woman C is just somehow being misunderstood or unclear rather than assuming Woman C is out for bear and has disdain for Woman A asking for advice.
I am pretty sure the Men's Only folder doesn't have these kinds of issues and discussions. (Stupid estrogen.)
Jeanie
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 3:02:29 PM
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TwinCityGirl
Posts: 951
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sideways
I remember thinking that you were using your own pregnancy announcement like a weapon.
I always thought it would be fun to just show up AFTER the baby was born and post "Hey, I had a baby over the weekend." Nobody had ever done that and I thought it would have been a fun surprise. We had any number of people IN REAL LIFE that learned about the pregnancy a week before he was born.
It ended up not going over well with people at all, here or in real life. I guess people feel you owe them earlier news of it, but I never felt that or feel like that with other people.
I must be alone in my thinking that pregnancy is personal and it's mine. We went through the infertility alone and were shocked at the pregnancy coming to fruition at all so it took months to believe it was really real for us. Infertility is a very alone thing. We had done so much just the two of us that it was "ours". It was just our thing, our little secret. We kind of liked it that way for a long time, and since I didn't show much for a long, long time it was easy to keep it that way even in real life.
I only blurted it out that day because I was getting the "you don't know how hard pregnancy is, you've never been pregnant" response from people and hey, enough is enough.
It wasn't meant as a weapon but doggone if I am going to be 9 months/1 week pregnant with people mad at me for ONE POST where I was trying to be playfully frank with a FRIEND and then have people telling me to back off I don't know what pregnancy is like.
Yeah, right. Try being 42 and pregnant. I know what pregnancy is like.
(I can laugh at it all now. I really can. Ah, the drama.)
Jeanie
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 3:05:02 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 3225
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TwinCityGirl
Now you take Woman A again, and it's a different day, different situation she wants advice on. And I'm Woman C. And I remember that in the past Woman A has accepted, laughed along with, and appreciated blunt advice like Woman B gave. So I phrase my response in the same way that Woman B did.
And then I am pounced on.
Whaaaaa??????!!!
I am pretty sure the Men's Only folder doesn't have these kinds of issues and discussions. (Stupid estrogen.)
Jeanie
Well, the reality of life is that some posters are more popular then other posters, and therefore they can get away with more. Just like high school. Some viewpoints are more popular then others, so if you're in the minority (let's say you work outside the home), then you'd better be prepared to defend yourself against some pretty intense attacks stopping just short of questioning your salvation (because that would be a TOS).
This forum both reflects and intensifies reality. There's a "in" crowd and an "out" crowd. It's not fair, but it's reality.
As far as the Men? Don't fool yourself, I don't go in there (hardly ever), but I've lived with men all my life. They have their hurt feelings and stupid dramas, just like we do. I refuse to believe that men are superior to me in any way except brute strength, just because they have a different physical makeup.
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 3:08:40 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 3225
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TwinCityGirl
We had any number of people IN REAL LIFE that learned about the pregnancy a week before he was born.
It ended up not going over well with people at all, here or in real life. I guess people feel you owe them earlier news of it, but I never felt that or feel like that with other people.
Really? You must've carried your pregnancy very well to not be showing that late in the game.
As far as owing people? Well, no, you don't; but if someone thinks that they are your friend, then I can see where they are justifiably hurt. They feel like they are a part of your life, and pregnancy is a HUGE part of anyone's life. They might like the opportunity to pray for your or bless you with a gift.
I would be hurt, if it were me.
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RE: General Mommy Thread - 7/10/2008 3:12:38 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10274
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
Status: online
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quote:
I am pretty sure the Men's Only folder doesn't have these kinds of issues and discussions. (Stupid estrogen.)
I think you're right. Maybe I should reconsider replacing my stupid estrogen after my surgery.
quote:
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I just burst into tears when I read that. I'm a little fragile today, I guess. 
