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tucole -> newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 2:56:56 AM)

I live in the mid east coast of the U.S and I see what's going on in California where the state courts overturn the voters decision on gay marriage (go figure) and in Newyork where the governor is scared to be sued b/c of one line that no one knew about. And might I ad I heard on the radio that colorado is considering allowing people who feel they are another gender but are physically not , will be allowed to go into the opposite sex rest rooms anyone who opposes them could face disrimination charges. MY question is I see this on the news in the paper and on the internet and my question is Where is the Church? New York & Cali have more Mega churches & reg churches than any state. So where are they? Are they planning a march, a demonstration a sit down, a boycott, anything? Are they preaching about it or calling for a recount revote or reversal or somthing? Are they crying alloud and sparing not lifting up the voices like a trumpet? If so I can't hear them or the media hasn't taken notice. If you live in any of the 3 states and know what i am talking about please let me know your feed back on what the church is doing to combat this mis and injustice.



SonInMe1 -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 7:51:15 AM)

There are many christians who believe political activism by the church is wrong.

In most ways I disagree with that position. Who is going to stand for christian principles, if not for us?

I dislike partisan politics...democrat vs. republican...but I do believe christians should be vocal.



URForgiven -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:00:53 AM)

The mainline denominations are mostly onboard with this, and those that are not are being torn apart by it. When denominations get to where they feel they can decide truth for themselves, then you can believe anything and everything. And they do.

The mainline organized church has made itself irrelevant. What was once the bastion of truth, is now just another social organization. One cannot go to those churches for truth any longer, and that is about as sad as it gets.

The Church, the Body of Christ, the organism not the organization, is alive but crippled and the organized church is in shambles.

Personally, I do not pray for revival, I pray for reformation, as I believe 'we' have not moved far enough forwards to get back to where Christianity was in the beginning. It is either that or "come Lord Jesus".

Peace



jn1010lf -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:26:45 AM)

Hello tucole

This nation desperately needs a Holy Ghost revival. One has started in Lakeland Fla. but guess who is objecting the most to it. No it's not our enlightend media. No, it's not the ACLU. Sadly enough, it's the religious crowd; those of fundamentalist and liberal bents; those that teach against the work of the Holy Spirit; miracles are not for today.

What you see in Cal and NY is only a tip of the iceberg. We are in the final battle for the hearts of man. It's going to get far worse before Jesus returns. But consider the promises for those that endure to the end.



Szaftoo -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:41:59 AM)

I doubt you will ever hear or see on the news what believers are doing to combat darkness. Demonstrations and rallies show solidarity but it's also the practical things that bring results. In some cities, pastors from different congregations meet weekly to pray for their city. Others have set aside certain days for their body to fast and pray. Churches circulate petitions to get measures on the ballot. During gay pride events, there are always churches with a booth to witness and pray with people. Christians attend city meetings or run for office to try and make a difference.

It feels like Daniel who had to wait for the angel to battle darkness before having his prayers answered.



JimboFletch -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:47:46 AM)

quote:

...fundamentalist and liberal bents; those that teach against the work of the Holy Spirit; miracles are not for today.

All false claims against believers that put scripture above experience, truth against entertainment, sound preaching against snake-handler theatrics.
[8|]



bluestone -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:53:11 AM)

I agree with Jimbo. False revivals are breaking out in Florida and now Atlanta. The church has so much apostasy going on within to deal with, sometimes it is hard to find the time to get out and officially come against legal things that go against scripture and common decency.



Kat_D -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:59:06 AM)

California here...Regarding the Same Sex Marriage bill, our church made phone calls to their government representatives, prayed, and signed petitions against it...all to no avail.

Our nation and it's people have turned their back on God as the Bible said it would:

1 "But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God," -II Timothy 3

Here is the antidote to what ails this country:

14 "If My people who are called by My name will humble themselves, and pray and seek My face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and heal their land." -II Chronicles 7

Oh, and P.S. to the poster who spoke about the Lakeland Revival...Christians who know the Word of God are against it because it blasphemes the Scriptures. If Christians followed the II Chronicles Scripture I quoted, REAL revival would break out in this country like we've never seen before. Repentance, not signs and wonders, is the first step to revival.

Back to your regularly scheduled subject.[;)]



TJStarfire -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 12:27:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tucole
If you live in any of the 3 states and know what i am talking about please let me know your feed back on what the church is doing to combat this mis and injustice.


Are you asking what a Christian should do?
Philippians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.



davemiller7 -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 12:29:49 PM)

Great post, URForgiven. It seems like the mainline denominations are more interested in numbers (both congregation size and dollars) than in doing what we were commanded to do - feed His sheep, spread the Word Of Truth. Many churches are not only IN the world, but have become OF the world in order to attract more people. I've seen this in a number of different churches. They have dropped the ball and are not doing the Lord's work.

In my humble opinion, for what it's worth...........

-Dave

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven

The mainline denominations are mostly onboard with this, and those that are not are being torn apart by it. When denominations get to where they feel they can decide truth for themselves, then you can believe anything and everything. And they do.

The mainline organized church has made itself irrelevant. What was once the bastion of truth, is now just another social organization. One cannot go to those churches for truth any longer, and that is about as sad as it gets.

The Church, the Body of Christ, the organism not the organization, is alive but crippled and the organized church is in shambles.

Personally, I do not pray for revival, I pray for reformation, as I believe 'we' have not moved far enough forwards to get back to where Christianity was in the beginning. It is either that or "come Lord Jesus".

Peace



SonInMe1 -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 9:50:40 PM)

I have to say this about these "revivals". Time will test its reality. People getting excited over some evangilist is not revival. Revivla is when an area changes for the Lord and its...permenent. Its too soon to tell if any of these "revivals" are true revivals.

Its easy to bash the organized church...and I have some reservations about them as well. Unfortunately, the more churches you group together the more man's influence takes over. Probably many reasons for that.



CherishedbyGod -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/4/2008 10:02:31 PM)

I live in California and I believe the battle should be done on our knees. It is a spiritual battle...

2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land



terryjohn -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/5/2008 1:15:20 PM)

The testimony of the church is not in political action, protests or in condeming unbeleivers for doing what comes naturally to brute beasts but in living as Christ themselves. Loud angry voices only go to drive wild beasts away. By all means drive the beast out of your garden but that does not tame them as much as an outstretched hand would.



iluvatar -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/5/2008 8:56:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven

The mainline organized church has made itself irrelevant.


One of the ways in which this was accomplished was by falling lockstep in line with the Republican party and focusing the church's attention on a few political causes to the near-exclusion of all others. Homosexuality is wrong, but it's not the only wrong. To focus so heavily on it, opposing it under the guise of "family values" while ignoring many of the problems that are causing Christian families to falling apart is, IMO hypocrisy of the highest order.

-Dan.



SonInMe1 -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/6/2008 7:41:24 AM)

quote:

One of the ways in which this was accomplished was by falling lockstep in line with the Republican party and focusing the church's attention on a few political causes to the near-exclusion of all others.


I don't know any churches that are exclusivly political.



iluvatar -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/6/2008 8:13:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1

quote:

One of the ways in which this was accomplished was by falling lockstep in line with the Republican party and focusing the church's attention on a few political causes to the near-exclusion of all others.


I don't know any churches that are exclusivly political.


I don't mean exclusively political, I mean that of the political causes discussed, a few are harped on regularly while most/all others are excluded. The trend generally follows those of conservative/christian media outlets and usually goes something like this: LOTS of attention on abortion and homosexuality, passing dismissals of environmentalists and their "worship" of nature, and near silence on international humanitarian concerns.

-Dan.



SonInMe1 -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/6/2008 6:34:21 PM)

I have on occaision heard these issues discussed from the pulpit but never in any great amount...eh...maybe there are churches that do this but I am not sure I would classify them as christian.

Some churches are clubs and they use Jesus as an excuse to meet.

Abortion and homosexuality are the big issues of the day and I think important relevent issues should be discussed in church.

Promoting a party or candidate over another is not what church should be. Teaching a christian perspective is. I would consider abortion and homosexuality as sins. I think the best place to learn about sins is church.



HisFish -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/6/2008 10:46:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven

Personally, I do not pray for revival, I pray for reformation, as I believe 'we' have not moved far enough forwards to get back to where Christianity was in the beginning. It is either that or "come Lord Jesus".

Peace

Very good point.



colliefan -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/6/2008 11:03:01 PM)

It is easier to light a candle than to curse the darkness. The church must first focus on changing hearts. When hearts are changed, laws will follow.



SonInMe1 -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/7/2008 8:06:57 AM)

quote:

The church must first focus on changing hearts. When hearts are changed, laws will follow.


How...if christians are not to take part in the political process?



deermousie -> RE: newyork & california where is the church (6/8/2008 4:18:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1

quote:

The church must first focus on changing hearts. When hearts are changed, laws will follow.


How...if christians are not to take part in the political process?


In the late 1800s and early 1900s Christians started getting out of politics because it was considered a "dirty business." And so it was. But now nonchristians are running the show unopposed, so no wonder it's a mess.

There are training conferences going on for Christian young people to enter politics (Teen Pac, for example) and occasionally training for adults to learn how to involve themselves. I think we need to train ourselves, make noise, expect heavy artillery (sp?), and train our kids for the battle. Also, we need to groom and push godly men and women into office and support them.



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