quote:

ORIGINAL: tracydolls

quote:

Would you like it better if we lived in poverty?

There is a difference between poverty and riches.

It's easy to say be content with what you have, when you got everything.

To me there is a difference between owning 2 SUV's and 3 small cars and owning one.

A difference between $4000 shoes and $40 shoes.

We have tooo much. That is undeniable. When the poor of your country is richer than whole countries. There's something wrong. It's not even.


1Jn 3:17 But whoever has this world's goods and sees his brother having need, and shuts up his bowels from him, how does the love of God dwell in him?
1Jn 3:18 My children, let us not love in word or in tongue, but in deed and in truth.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kernsfamily

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
I suppose you could say that his was the last administration where a middle class earner could afford to fuel one.

Hmmm....so are all of these SUVs i see all over my neighborhood....(packed with kids, camping/boy scout equipment, neighborhood kids, soccer teams, stuff from Lowes/Home Depot, etc..etc..).....they are all just "figments" of my imagination?....since, as you say a "middle class earner" can't afford to fuel one?

quote:

ORIGINAL: lightshineon

Wll greed is bad, and many people are greedy. I think the Arab Shieks have that one over the Americans though. They own the oil making the prices higher, on gas and making the economy got to the dogs. They are Muslim, who want to take over the world, so ok this is ugly, but maybe BO should have a little talk with his friends, and get them to lower oil prices. That way he could put his money where his mouth is.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

quote:

ORIGINAL: kernsfamily

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
I suppose you could say that his was the last administration where a middle class earner could afford to fuel one.

Hmmm....so are all of these SUVs i see all over my neighborhood....(packed with kids, camping/boy scout equipment, neighborhood kids, soccer teams, stuff from Lowes/Home Depot, etc..etc..).....they are all just "figments" of my imagination?....since, as you say a "middle class earner" can't afford to fuel one?

You, then, must be in an upper middle-class neighborhood, certainly far ritzier than my humble subdivision. Me, I haven't even had a cost of living increase in over 2 years, much less a raise.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

quote:

ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac
You don't know the Supreme Court. Gerald Ford was pro-abortion.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/print.php?pid=6320

In any case, what does Gerald Ford have to do with SUVs?

I suppose you could say that his was the last administration where a middle class earner could afford to fuel one.

There is a portion of the green movement that believes in using sterilization and abortion to reduce energy use. I read recently of a couple who justified their plush vacations by not having children.

We don't have dirty, polluting children, so it's okay if we fly to Tahiti once a year.

And your point? So you're saying everyone must have children?

And, I'm not accusing, just asking.

And just an fyi, I want to have kids, and am having a hard time doing so (if we can't, we'll adopt, which I think is just as special, in a different way); but I have friends that do not want to have children. They say that they are sometimes ostracized for this by churches, which I find utterly ridiculous.

Peace and God bless,

There are lots of waiting children if you really are interested in adopting.

My point about the greenies avoiding having children is that there is a link between envrionmentalism and abortion. Environmentalists are pro abortion. Killing someone to save the planet is justifiable as long as it isn't them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc

quote:

ORIGINAL: its_GO_time
The key word here is conservative. This administration, is as conservative, as Gwen Stefani is creative. And Olympia Snowe may as well be a Democrat.

I really believe the majority of those, lapping up BHO's statements, such as this one, really don't want freedom, liberty, but are looking for that "just master'" to lead them around by the nose.

I think the irony here is that I would be a gung-ho conservative if Ron Paul had been elected back in 2000. Libertarian conservatism has a few flaws (pure laissez-faire Capitalism doesn't address monopolies, negative externalities, and environmental issues that threaten the sustainability of long-term Capitalism), but overall, it's more responsible than anything that modern liberalism or neoconservatism have to offer.

However, I am now convinced that politics has mostly turned into a football match, and I've found myself wearing a blue jersey, so unless I am presented with a clearly superior Republican candidate, I will likely continue voting Demcoratic.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

quote:

ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac
You don't know the Supreme Court. Gerald Ford was pro-abortion.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/print.php?pid=6320

In any case, what does Gerald Ford have to do with SUVs?

I suppose you could say that his was the last administration where a middle class earner could afford to fuel one.

There is a portion of the green movement that believes in using sterilization and abortion to reduce energy use. I read recently of a couple who justified their plush vacations by not having children.

We don't have dirty, polluting children, so it's okay if we fly to Tahiti once a year.

And your point? So you're saying everyone must have children?

And, I'm not accusing, just asking.

And just an fyi, I want to have kids, and am having a hard time doing so (if we can't, we'll adopt, which I think is just as special, in a different way); but I have friends that do not want to have children. They say that they are sometimes ostracized for this by churches, which I find utterly ridiculous.

Peace and God bless,

There are lots of waiting children if you really are interested in adopting.

My point about the greenies avoiding having children is that there is a link between envrionmentalism and abortion. Environmentalists are pro abortion. Killing someone to save the planet is justifiable as long as it isn't them.

Yes, I know that. I would love to adopt. I am going to try and give a go biologically first.

Anyway, well, you see, I am one of those greenies, and I know a lot of greenies - they're friends of mine - because I recieved my first degree in environmental science. I would say about half - two thirds of them are pro-life; so once again, you're wrong with your generalization.

Peace and God bless,

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

quote:

ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac
You don't know the Supreme Court. Gerald Ford was pro-abortion.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/print.php?pid=6320

In any case, what does Gerald Ford have to do with SUVs?

I suppose you could say that his was the last administration where a middle class earner could afford to fuel one.

There is a portion of the green movement that believes in using sterilization and abortion to reduce energy use. I read recently of a couple who justified their plush vacations by not having children.

We don't have dirty, polluting children, so it's okay if we fly to Tahiti once a year.

And your point? So you're saying everyone must have children?

And, I'm not accusing, just asking.

And just an fyi, I want to have kids, and am having a hard time doing so (if we can't, we'll adopt, which I think is just as special, in a different way); but I have friends that do not want to have children. They say that they are sometimes ostracized for this by churches, which I find utterly ridiculous.

Peace and God bless,

There are lots of waiting children if you really are interested in adopting.

My point about the greenies avoiding having children is that there is a link between envrionmentalism and abortion. Environmentalists are pro abortion. Killing someone to save the planet is justifiable as long as it isn't them.

Yes, I know that. I would love to adopt. I am going to try and give a go biologically first.

Anyway, well, you see, I am one of those greenies, and I know a lot of greenies - they're friends of mine - because I recieved my first degree in environmental science. I would say about half - two thirds of them are pro-life; so once again, you're wrong with your generalization.

Peace and God bless,

What recognizable environmental organization is pro-life? I've never heard one oppose abortion in any sense of the word unless it applied to an animal. They are stridently in favor of "population control," which employs abortion as a tool.

"Having children is selfish. It's all about maintaining your genetic line at the expense of the planet," says Toni

"We feel we can have one long-haul flight a year, as we are vegan and childless, thereby greatly reducing our carbon footprint and combating over-population."

"I realised then that a baby would pollute the planet - and that never having a child was the most environmentally friendly thing I could do."

kill babies, save mother earth

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac

quote:

ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

quote:

ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc

quote:

ORIGINAL: ljmac
You don't know the Supreme Court. Gerald Ford was pro-abortion.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/print.php?pid=6320

In any case, what does Gerald Ford have to do with SUVs?

I suppose you could say that his was the last administration where a middle class earner could afford to fuel one.

There is a portion of the green movement that believes in using sterilization and abortion to reduce energy use. I read recently of a couple who justified their plush vacations by not having children.

We don't have dirty, polluting children, so it's okay if we fly to Tahiti once a year.

And your point? So you're saying everyone must have children?

And, I'm not accusing, just asking.

And just an fyi, I want to have kids, and am having a hard time doing so (if we can't, we'll adopt, which I think is just as special, in a different way); but I have friends that do not want to have children. They say that they are sometimes ostracized for this by churches, which I find utterly ridiculous.

Peace and God bless,

There are lots of waiting children if you really are interested in adopting.

My point about the greenies avoiding having children is that there is a link between envrionmentalism and abortion. Environmentalists are pro abortion. Killing someone to save the planet is justifiable as long as it isn't them.

Yes, I know that. I would love to adopt. I am going to try and give a go biologically first.

Anyway, well, you see, I am one of those greenies, and I know a lot of greenies - they're friends of mine - because I recieved my first degree in environmental science. I would say about half - two thirds of them are pro-life; so once again, you're wrong with your generalization.

Peace and God bless,

What recognizable environmental organization is pro-life? I've never heard one oppose abortion in any sense of the word unless it applied to an animal. They are stridently in favor of "population control," which employs abortion as a tool.

"Having children is selfish. It's all about maintaining your genetic line at the expense of the planet," says Toni

"We feel we can have one long-haul flight a year, as we are vegan and childless, thereby greatly reducing our carbon footprint and combating over-population."

"I realised then that a baby would pollute the planet - and that never having a child was the most environmentally friendly thing I could do."

kill babies, save mother earth

Here we go again...

ljmac,

This link is about individuals, not environmental organizations, ljmac. I consider myself an environmentalist - and I would LOVE to have a baby - would you care to challenge me on this?! Because, I am 38 and very emotional about this, to give proper warning...

In any event, yes, I can think of quite a few: my friends; Audubon Society, National Wildlife, World Wildlife Fund, Ocean Conservancy to name a few.

And nice touch on naming your link...

Peace and God bless,

quote:

ORIGINAL: rlj

LJ, are you even saved? I honestly can't imagine any christian would willingly take any topic to the extreme that you have just taken this one.

Liz- you are definately in my prayers. : )

quote:

There is a health and fitness forum. Maybe someone there can help correct your limited imagination.

quote:

but for the life of me, do not understand the agreement some have with selling out their freedom, because other countries refuse to overthrow their repressive governments, and join the world economy. BO, and other's answer, is to bring us down to their level(although not affecting him, or anyone else in DC, for that matter).

quote:



Here we go again...

ljmac,

This link is about individuals, not environmental organizations, ljmac. I consider myself an environmentalist - and I would LOVE to have a baby - would you care to challenge me on this?! Because, I am 38 and very emotional about this, to give proper warning...

In any event, yes, I can think of quite a few: my friends; Audubon Society, National Wildlife, World Wildlife Fund, Ocean Conservancy to name a few.

And nice touch on naming your link...

Peace and God bless,

quote:

I think it's just great that you want a baby.

There is a strong link between environmentalism and population control. One of the tools in the population control movement is abortion.

You provided names of some organizations you say are pro-life, but no evidence.

When the Audubon Society gave an award to the Rockefeller Foundation, they cited Nelson Rockefeller's signing of a "pioneering state law" legalizing abortion as one of the family's wonderful accomplishments.
birds yes, babies no

Audubon also, along with the Sierra Club, donates money to Planned Parenthood, the abortion company. Imagine that, you give them money to save a bird, and they give it to someone to abort a child.
green blood money

I could go on and on about the environmentalism - abortion link. For example Paul Ehrlich, the population control nut who advocates easy access to abortion, has received distinguished awards from numerous environmental organizations including some of those you mentioned.
we're not pro-life

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

Here we go again...

ljmac,

This link is about individuals, not environmental organizations, ljmac. I consider myself an environmentalist - and I would LOVE to have a baby - would you care to challenge me on this?! Because, I am 38 and very emotional about this, to give proper warning...

In any event, yes, I can think of quite a few: my friends; Audubon Society, National Wildlife, World Wildlife Fund, Ocean Conservancy to name a few.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

Here we go again...

ljmac,

This link is about individuals, not environmental organizations, ljmac. I consider myself an environmentalist - and I would LOVE to have a baby - would you care to challenge me on this?! Because, I am 38 and very emotional about this, to give proper warning...

In any event, yes, I can think of quite a few: my friends; Audubon Society, National Wildlife, World Wildlife Fund, Ocean Conservancy to name a few.

I think you need to update your list...

http://magazine.audubon.org/resolutions.html

The Audubon Society supports Planned Parenthood....

Think Small

To lighten the load on the earth, we need to lower the birth rate and reduce consumption. Here are some ways to change your own life-and to get your government to change, too.


Push condoms. Currently, some 350 million couples worldwide have no access to family-planning programs. Urge your congressmembers to fund international education and family-planning programs. Support organizations such as the National Audubon Society's Population and Habitat Campaign (800-741-9658; www.earthnet.net/~popnet) and the Planned Parenthood Federation of America (800-669-0156; www.plannedparenthood.org).


http://worldwildlife.org/what/whowehelp/community/item7044.html


The World Wildlife Fund isn't pro-life...

What is WWF's position on abortion?
WWF does not work on abortion issues and therefore does not take a stance on this issue. WWF observes the national laws of the places where we work and the legal requirements of accepting certain donor funds for population work. For example, WWF does not give USAID population funds to non-US non-governmental organizations that support abortion, in accordance with the U.S. government's Mexico City Policy.


What is WWF's strategic advantage in working on family planning?

WWF is a multinational conservation organization, protecting nature in 100 countries. At the local level, our unique way of working offers several advantages that benefit both people and nature:

WWF brings family planning and basic health services to some of the most remote, underserved, insecure and traditional communities in the world. We help to fill gaps in health sector coverage, including unmet needs for family planning in some of the poorest rural communities, to benefit communities and slow the pressure of population growth on biodiversity.

As well as family planning, WWF typically works with communities on a range of activities such as basic health, livelihoods and more sustainable management of the community's natural resources and biodiversity. Healthier communities with smaller, well-spaced families are better stewards of nature and are more economically secure because they have sustainable livelihoods. Communities are generally more motivated to collaborate on conservation issues when they learn that WWF considers their immediate and long-term well-being to be part of its mission.

Linked environment-population-health messages are more meaningful for many decision-makers than single issue advocacy and this can help influence policy and donor funding. As a respected global conservation organization, WWF is able to dramatically expand the target audience for messages about family planning - moving beyond the traditional audience reached by the health sector.

Family planning includes abortion...


National Wildlife Federation is linked with Planned Parenthood...
http://www.plannedparenthoodnj.org/links/index.php
National Wildlife Federation's Population and Environment Program The National Wildlife Federation's Population and Environment Program works to achieve a sustainable balance among the world's population, environmental quality, wildlife and wildlife habitat, and our finite natural resources.

quote:

BP America, American Express, General Mills, Citicorp, Bristol Meyers, Chase Manhatten bank

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

I think you need to update your list...

http://magazine.audubon.org/resolutions.html

The Audubon Society supports Planned Parenthood....

Think Small

To lighten the load on the earth, we need to lower the birth rate and reduce consumption. Here are some ways to change your own life-and to get your government to change, too.


Push condoms. Currently, some 350 million couples worldwide have no access to family-planning programs. Urge your congressmembers to fund international education and family-planning programs. Support organizations such as the National Audubon Society's Population and Habitat Campaign (800-741-9658; www.earthnet.net/~popnet) and the Planned Parenthood Federation of America (800-669-0156; www.plannedparenthood.org).


http://worldwildlife.org/what/whowehelp/community/item7044.html


The World Wildlife Fund isn't pro-life...

What is WWF's position on abortion?
WWF does not work on abortion issues and therefore does not take a stance on this issue. WWF observes the national laws of the places where we work and the legal requirements of accepting certain donor funds for population work. For example, WWF does not give USAID population funds to non-US non-governmental organizations that support abortion, in accordance with the U.S. government's Mexico City Policy.


What is WWF's strategic advantage in working on family planning?

WWF is a multinational conservation organization, protecting nature in 100 countries. At the local level, our unique way of working offers several advantages that benefit both people and nature:

WWF brings family planning and basic health services to some of the most remote, underserved, insecure and traditional communities in the world. We help to fill gaps in health sector coverage, including unmet needs for family planning in some of the poorest rural communities, to benefit communities and slow the pressure of population growth on biodiversity.

As well as family planning, WWF typically works with communities on a range of activities such as basic health, livelihoods and more sustainable management of the community's natural resources and biodiversity. Healthier communities with smaller, well-spaced families are better stewards of nature and are more economically secure because they have sustainable livelihoods. Communities are generally more motivated to collaborate on conservation issues when they learn that WWF considers their immediate and long-term well-being to be part of its mission.

Linked environment-population-health messages are more meaningful for many decision-makers than single issue advocacy and this can help influence policy and donor funding. As a respected global conservation organization, WWF is able to dramatically expand the target audience for messages about family planning - moving beyond the traditional audience reached by the health sector.

Family planning includes abortion...


National Wildlife Federation is linked with Planned Parenthood...
http://www.plannedparenthoodnj.org/links/index.php
National Wildlife Federation's Population and Environment Program The National Wildlife Federation's Population and Environment Program works to achieve a sustainable balance among the world's population, environmental quality, wildlife and wildlife habitat, and our finite natural resources.

quote:

So, John, since BP America, American Express, General Mills, Citicorp, Bristol Meyers, Chase Manhatten bank, others donate to PP - are you saying there is also a strong link between abortion and cereal, food, medicine, vitamin makers; between abortion and banks; between abortion and gas companies?

quote:

ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

I think you need to update your list...

http://magazine.audubon.org/resolutions.html

The Audubon Society supports Planned Parenthood....

Think Small

To lighten the load on the earth, we need to lower the birth rate and reduce consumption. Here are some ways to change your own life-and to get your government to change, too.


Push condoms. Currently, some 350 million couples worldwide have no access to family-planning programs. Urge your congressmembers to fund international education and family-planning programs. Support organizations such as the National Audubon Society's Population and Habitat Campaign (800-741-9658; www.earthnet.net/~popnet) and the Planned Parenthood Federation of America (800-669-0156; www.plannedparenthood.org).


http://worldwildlife.org/what/whowehelp/community/item7044.html


The World Wildlife Fund isn't pro-life...

What is WWF's position on abortion?
WWF does not work on abortion issues and therefore does not take a stance on this issue. WWF observes the national laws of the places where we work and the legal requirements of accepting certain donor funds for population work. For example, WWF does not give USAID population funds to non-US non-governmental organizations that support abortion, in accordance with the U.S. government's Mexico City Policy.


What is WWF's strategic advantage in working on family planning?

WWF is a multinational conservation organization, protecting nature in 100 countries. At the local level, our unique way of working offers several advantages that benefit both people and nature:

WWF brings family planning and basic health services to some of the most remote, underserved, insecure and traditional communities in the world. We help to fill gaps in health sector coverage, including unmet needs for family planning in some of the poorest rural communities, to benefit communities and slow the pressure of population growth on biodiversity.

As well as family planning, WWF typically works with communities on a range of activities such as basic health, livelihoods and more sustainable management of the community's natural resources and biodiversity. Healthier communities with smaller, well-spaced families are better stewards of nature and are more economically secure because they have sustainable livelihoods. Communities are generally more motivated to collaborate on conservation issues when they learn that WWF considers their immediate and long-term well-being to be part of its mission.

Linked environment-population-health messages are more meaningful for many decision-makers than single issue advocacy and this can help influence policy and donor funding. As a respected global conservation organization, WWF is able to dramatically expand the target audience for messages about family planning - moving beyond the traditional audience reached by the health sector.

Family planning includes abortion...


National Wildlife Federation is linked with Planned Parenthood...
http://www.plannedparenthoodnj.org/links/index.php
National Wildlife Federation's Population and Environment Program The National Wildlife Federation's Population and Environment Program works to achieve a sustainable balance among the world's population, environmental quality, wildlife and wildlife habitat, and our finite natural resources.

You said the above recognizable environmental organization were pro-life and you are wrong... In fact they are pro-abortion...

quote:

So, John, since BP America, American Express, General Mills, Citicorp, Bristol Meyers, Chase Manhatten bank, others donate to PP - are you saying there is also a strong link between abortion and cereal, food, medicine, vitamin makers; between abortion and banks; between abortion and gas companies?

I would say they share the same lack of regard for they unborn that you and most environmental organization demostrate...

You can pretend that the folks who support a smaller population are somehow for <cough> family planning and at the same time, pro-life but that's the same as saying blue is red...

John

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

quote:

ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lizahana

I think you need to update your list...

http://m