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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 9:56:40 AM
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landabee
Posts: 2988
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Central Florida
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TomTurn
quote:
I highly doubt that he'd even be able to use the defense that some of his best friends are "liberal"
Gay liberals actually
Nice to know you get out and about.
_____________________________
"Sound theology discourages ignorance instead of promoting it." ~ CourdeLeon
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 11:14:02 AM
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tracydolls
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quote:
Your changing the words. She said all racism matters, I say it does not. As in if this t-shirt is seen as racist, it does not matter. Not that big of a deal.
Main thing is you nor anyone else has proven this t-shirt to be racsit.
All racism matters, try to fool G-D with that mess.
It's racist. Plain and simple.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 11:47:55 AM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
All racism matters, try to fool G-D with that mess.
Does that include black against white racism such as Obama's rev. White.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 11:52:52 AM
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tracydolls
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quote:
Does that include black against white racism such as Obama's rev. White.
of course it does G-D is no respecter of person. I personally think Wright should not have been spewing it from the pulpit. But he has got to answer for it.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 11:57:36 AM
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saved9201
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
All racism matters, try to fool G-D with that mess.
Does that include black against white racism such as Obama's rev. White.
Thanks
RC
I vote yes. And your point is....?
- Julius
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 12:00:52 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
Some might find it funny.
Then by all means, go do it. Go see how many people in a black neighborhood find that shirt funny. Then afterwards, go tromp thru a Jewish neighborhood wearing another shirt with saying "Hitler Was Right." I'm sure they'll find it hilarious also.
quote:
To assume all would dislike it is making a judgment on all based on their race.
Do you actually know anyone who's been directly impacted by racism, and how it affects people? Or do you just live in a bubble?
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 12:06:50 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
We tolerate forms of racsim all the time. I mentioned above rap music. We have movies that we tolerate. We have books that we tolerate. And on and on.
Not to go into a sociology lecture, but the context in which "the n-word" is used in black culture is different than how it is used by whites against them in a historical context - just as the word "queer" has taken on a different meaning in the gay community.
Other forms of racism (including the Obama shirt) are indeed protected by the First Amendment, but that doesn't mean they are morally right, or should not be spoken out against.
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 12:12:35 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
If it were an actual photo of Obama eating watermelon and it were put on a shirt, would that be racist?
Actually, this is a good question. It would depend upon the context - say, a shot of Obama at a summer picnic having melon.
But I think most newspapers would not run that photo because of its historical implication, considering how watermelons have often been used in a racist context against blacks.
As for wearing the same image on a shirt, I sure wouldn't do it.
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 12:25:39 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: saved9201
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
All racism matters, try to fool G-D with that mess.
Does that include black against white racism such as Obama's rev. White.
Thanks
RC
I vote yes. And your point is....?
- Julius
My point? It has been argued on on this forum that it is impossible for a black to be guilty of racism because only a majority can have racism towards a minority and I just wondered where Tracydolls stood.
Thsnks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 1:10:34 PM
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tracydolls
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quote:
My point? It has been argued on on this forum that it is impossible for a black to be guilty of racism because only a majority can have racism towards a minority and I just wondered where Tracydolls stood.
Blacks can be guilty of racism, I know I was. Some blacks are reacting with anger towards the oppresion, I don't think they are racists. Just want it too stop. Some like myself , a racist.
Blacks don't control the important places or institutions in this country.
I Could not stand people based solely on skin color. My own mother included.
I had to repent, try to make amends, and move on. Sometimes I want to go back when I see others being racist. Especially in this season. But I've learned hate breeds hate.
The history that goes with portraying blacks as animals is racist.
this t-shirt is racist. But I suspect as BO wins, it will get worse.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 2:29:03 PM
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davemiller7
Posts: 848
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From: NC via NY
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May I extrapolate from your posts that only white, straight, American males can be guilty of racism? That's what it sounds like to me.
-Dave
White straight American male
quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
quote:
We tolerate forms of racsim all the time. I mentioned above rap music. We have movies that we tolerate. We have books that we tolerate. And on and on.
Not to go into a sociology lecture, but the context in which "the n-word" is used in black culture is different than how it is used by whites against them in a historical context - just as the word "queer" has taken on a different meaning in the gay community.
Other forms of racism (including the Obama shirt) are indeed protected by the First Amendment, but that doesn't mean they are morally right, or should not be spoken out against.
_____________________________
-Dave
The Prayer of Protection
The light of God surrounds me,
The love of God enfolds me,
The power of God protects me,
The presence of God watches over me.
Wherever I am, God is.
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 2:41:32 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
May I extrapolate from your posts that only white, straight, American males can be guilty of racism? That's what it sounds like to me.
No, I don't feel that way at all.
In fact, in my community (which is primarily Hispanic) there is a lot of racial tension between Puerto Ricans and Mexicans.
Why? I'm not sure, but the angst is definitely there.
No one people has a monopoly on racism. Anyone can dish it out.
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 3:06:53 PM
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TomTurn
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quote:
Then by all means, go do it. Go see how many people in a black neighborhood find that shirt funny
Some will not, just like here. And some will. But to assume all blacks would be offended or that one could not hold their dislike about it and get physical is making an assumption based on race. Which we know what that is.
quote:
Do you actually know anyone who's been directly impacted by racism, and how it affects people? Or do you just live in a bubble?
Everyone does but you cannot assume all would dislike or like something becasue of their race.
quote:
Other forms of racism (including the Obama shirt) are indeed protected by the First Amendment, but that doesn't mean they are morally right, or should not be spoken out against.
As for this shirt, it could have been done differently but what we see as racist may not be on the part of the person doing so. They may be innocent. If I wear red into a gang area does that make me a blood or just an innocent person wearing red? Or maybe I am a person trying to remove the power the color red has there?
quote:
But I think most newspapers would not run that photo because of its historical implication, considering how watermelons have often been used in a racist context against blacks. As for wearing the same image on a shirt, I sure wouldn't do it.
No they would not, but what better way to get past a lot of these stereotypes, etc. than just take their power away to mean nothing other than a man enjoying eating. And to do that you just have to face it head on.
< Message edited by TomTurn -- 5/17/2008 3:16:38 PM >
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 6:50:23 PM
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todd_t
Posts: 1325
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quote:
Everyone does but you cannot assume all would dislike or like something becasue of their race.
Everyone lives in a bubble? Give me a break. Some of us live in reality, thank you.
Secondly, to assume that folks in a black neighborhood would be offended by a white guy strolling their streets in a t-shirt depicting any caricature of an African-American male (Obama or not) chomping on a watermelon is not racism. It is common sense. If you can't recognize this, I truly suspect you do not understand what racism is, and how it impacts others.
quote:
As for this shirt, it could have been done differently but what we see as racist may not be on the part of the person doing so. They may be innocent.
If the person who created the Obama shirt did so with no racial intent, then he is incredibly ignorant - which is almost as bad as being an overt racist.
Racism (of any type versus any people) thrives on ignorance.
quote:
If I wear red into a gang area does that make me a blood or just an innocent person wearing red? Or maybe I am a person trying to remove the power the color red has there?
I don't know, but you would certainly be putting your own life at risk.
quote:
No they would not, but what better way to get past a lot of these stereotypes, etc. than just take their power away to mean nothing other than a man enjoying eating. And to do that you just have to face it head on.
I agree. Racism should be confronted head-on, but also intelligently.
I can't stress enough how important having a historic context is in being considerate of others vis-a-vis symbols or images they may interpret as deliberately offensive. Thus, no one would think twice about a photo of Barack Obama eating BBQ at a picnic, but watermelon would be something entirely different.
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/17/2008 7:02:55 PM
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TomTurn
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quote:
Everyone lives in a bubble? Give me a break.
Everyone knows someone who's been directly impacted by racism.
Too tired to write anymore for now
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 9:11:25 AM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
Secondly, to assume that folks in a black neighborhood would be offended by a white guy strolling their streets in a t-shirt depicting any caricature of an African-American male (Obama or not) chomping on a watermelon is not racism. It is common sense.
I do think your assumption that all dem blacks would be of one mind is racism in its purest form.
You may call it common sense, but you err: in the same way you claim I err because I think that seeing the estreme resemblance in appearance and actions between Curious George and Obama is just common sense and non-racist observation. To deny that resemblance is just sticking your head in the sand.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 9:45:04 AM
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Birdiecat
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Let's back for a minute to watermelons. Barack Obama's father was African, correct? Watermelons come from Africa. Wouldn't it be natural for an African-American to like watermelons? Being brought up white in 1949. A family with money, grandparents holding political office (governor), grandmother state tax collector. We always had Black people in our homes. And yes, they worked for us. We all became extended family. I was never taught racism. I loved Mary Boyd and Delia with all my heart! I just don't understand why people can't get along. Again I say, some child made a remark that Obama looks like Curious George. It was NOT meant as a racist remark. Adults did that!! By the way, most kids love Curious George.
_____________________________
Come, Lord Jesus!
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 10:01:20 AM
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bluestone
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Birdiecat,
It was not a child that had the t-shirts printed and sold. That was a grown man and business owner.
_____________________________
I need Christ. Not something that resembles Christ.
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 3:03:17 PM
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saved9201
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I know most of ya'll hate Obama. I don't care why. But this is a Christian forum and we should be offended by any depiction of any human being as an ape, whether it's a cute ape or not. If not because of racism, which some of you no doubt get offended if the mere existence of this concept is suggested, but by the fact that it legitimizes the anti-Christian concept of evolution. I didn't come from a monkey. Neither did Bush, neither did Obama.
- Julius
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 3:31:01 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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While the T-shirt itself can be without racial foundation only someone living in a cave the last 400 years can pretend that people are not going to derived from it racism because of what has and is going on in the world. I didn't grow up in the South, but I did grow up in South Sacramento( a very, very diverse area) and I heard more than once white and black kids(and even adults) making references to black and apes…
John
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 3:33:15 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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For the record I do not hate Obama, I just don't care for anyone who can speak of abortion(cold blooded mass murder) like it's nothing more than choosing 2% mike over full milk...
John
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 7:49:00 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 5229
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From: Oklahoma
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quote:
ORIGINAL: saved9201
I know most of ya'll hate Obama. I don't care why. But this is a Christian forum and we should be offended by any depiction of any human being as an ape, whether it's a cute ape or not. If not because of racism, which some of you no doubt get offended if the mere existence of this concept is suggested, but by the fact that it legitimizes the anti-Christian concept of evolution. I didn't come from a monkey. Neither did Bush, neither did Obama.
- Julius
I do not believe anyone on the forums has said we came from monkeys.
The cartoon character and Obama have an uncanny resemplance to each other and that is just plain fact.
If Obama resempled the Geico Gecko I wouold see nothing wrong with pointing it out either.
Folks are just way too sensitive.
And I do not hate Obama, just cannot in any way, form, or fashion support anyone who is pro-abortion, gay marriage promoting, far left liberal demokrat.
Thanks
RC
< Message edited by rcjames -- 5/18/2008 7:56:17 PM >
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Curious George/Obama T-Shirt Racist? - 5/18/2008 9:36:27 PM
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ken1906_4
Posts: 296
Joined: 10/6/2006
From: Maryland
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: saved9201
I know most of ya'll hate Obama. I don't care why. But this is a Christian forum and we should be offended by any depiction of any human being as an ape, whether it's a cute ape or not. If not because of racism, which some of you no doubt get offended if the mere existence of this concept is suggested, but by the fact that it legitimizes the anti-Christian concept of evolution. I didn't come from a monkey. Neither did Bush, neither did Obama.
- Julius
I do not believe anyone on the forums has said we came from monkeys.
The cartoon character and Obama have an uncanny resemplance to each other and that is just plain fact.
If Obama resempled the Geico Gecko I wouold see nothing wrong with pointing it out either.
Folks are just way too sensitive.
And I do not hate Obama, just cannot in any way, form, or fashion support anyone who is pro-abortion, gay marriage promoting, far left liberal demokrat.
Thanks
RC
That's a very poor comparison. African Americans were never characterized as Gecko’s; we have historically been characterized as monkeys and apes. Your comparisons it's not the same. and makes little sense. Take off the blinders, get your head out the sand and see this for what it is an offensive racial slur. You up here calling people too sensitive...well imagine if you were African American, are you going to sit here and tell us this is not offensive?
Honestly, I'm not an Obama supporter and I more than likely will not be voting for him so I'm not defending him because he's my candidate, he is not. I'm defending him because racial shots such as these need to be put away with. On paper, I bet this guy probably calls himself a Christian...well there is nothing Christian about this and you are here justifying and defending this guy's racist’s actions. Coming from someone who is brother in Christ and a pastor your response is questionable and disappointing, but since being on CW your response to this debate does not surprise me. 
_____________________________
"Choosing between Republicans and Democrats is like choosing between the Pharisees and Sadducees. Both are enemies of Christ."
True colors are being revealed
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In fact, as far as I'm concerned, Obama can be Curious George to the Country Preacher if he wants him to be. Who else you want him to be, Country Preacher? Cat in the Hat? 
Whatever you want Country Preacher. Whatever you want. 
Now can we move on? This is getting ridiculous.