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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/11/2008 9:18:18 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2165
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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During the Welsh Revival, bars were shut down and houses of ill repute were closed due to lack of business. I wonder if anything of this sort is occuring in Lakeland and the surrounding cities? I can't watch the stuff cause it gives me the willies.
_____________________________
The grace of God is infinite and eternal. As it had no beginning, so it can have no end, and being an attribute of God, it is as boundless as infinitude.
A. W. Tozer (1897–1963)
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/11/2008 10:33:00 PM
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csl7037
Posts: 640
Joined: 3/24/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
During the Welsh Revival, bars were shut down and houses of ill repute were closed due to lack of business. I wonder if anything of this sort is occuring in Lakeland and the surrounding cities? I can't watch the stuff cause it gives me the willies.
Certainly not that I can see!
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/11/2008 11:23:50 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2165
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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In the little that I can stomach of the guy, he is not calling for repentance, renwal, and holy living. This verse seens to fit him
Lam 2:14 (ESV) 14 Your prophets have seen for you false and deceptive visions; they have not exposed your iniquity to restore your fortunes, but have seen for you oracles that are false and misleading.
_____________________________
The grace of God is infinite and eternal. As it had no beginning, so it can have no end, and being an attribute of God, it is as boundless as infinitude.
A. W. Tozer (1897–1963)
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/11/2008 11:44:17 PM
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madalluge
Posts: 3
Joined: 5/10/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
How many of you know this is wrong? If God heals, then you, I, we have nothing to do with it, we do not heal, God does. Todd has surrounded himself with Bob Jones and Paul Cain and expressed his admiration for Branham, Kuhlman, and Hinn. He's on the wrong track and the wrong understanding.
Problem is the Bible doesn't say that...Jesus said for you to heal the sick...
Matt 10:7-8 (NIV)
7As you go, preach this message: 'The kingdom of heaven is near.' 8Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy,[a]drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.
NASB
7"And as you go, preach, saying, '(A)The kingdom of heaven is at hand.'
8"Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out demons. Freely you received, freely give.
KJV
7And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
8Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/11/2008 11:57:29 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2165
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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Not to get into a debate regarding healing as I do believe God still heals today but not in the context of this charade.
_____________________________
The grace of God is infinite and eternal. As it had no beginning, so it can have no end, and being an attribute of God, it is as boundless as infinitude.
A. W. Tozer (1897–1963)
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 12:02:12 AM
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prophet
Posts: 224
Joined: 4/19/2005
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Issit Ok to post this? Its about this Florida thing
RADIO INTERVIEW about FLORIDA - Watchmen Radio
Last weekend Andrew Strom was interviewed on Watchmen
Radio concerning the Florida Healing revival (along with Matthew
Stephen). This may fill in some background for people. Please
take a listen.
Simply click on the link at the TOP RIGHT that says "FLORIDA
DECEPTION??" on the following website-
http://www.revivalschool.com
Shalom
_____________________________
Create in me a Clean Heart, O Lord.
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 12:33:14 AM
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Anisavta
Posts: 707
Joined: 1/20/2008
From: Northern CA
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The issue is not in whether the L~rd heals or whether we are called to pray for the sick. Yes Yeshua still heals. Yes we are to pray for the sick and expect healings. Post after post reflects that.
The issue is whether or not we are to follow after the leadings of spirit guides or angels. The issue is whether or not Todd or anyone should make fools out of people by kneeing them in the stomach or pushing people down.
Every time in scripture where people were healed, or raised from the dead or had any kind of miracle happen for them, there was dignity. Dignity for the person touched and dignity for the person administering the blessing. Video after video I have watched of Mr Bentley dealing with people have been humiliating and degrading.
Even Benny Hinn conducts his services with a measure of dignity.
Mr Bentley almost has a WWF approach to dealing with people. Put him in a venue of a wrestling match and his actions would be the same as in his services.
< Message edited by Anisavta -- 5/12/2008 12:40:27 AM >
_____________________________
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first!
B'rachot,
Marsha
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 6:58:45 AM
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earthless
Posts: 4829
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where bbq pigeons roast....
Status: online
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NO ONE has said that God does not heal today, because He does.
What is being discussed are all the false teachings and downright circus shenanigans down in the name of God.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 9:08:18 AM
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Soxfan
Posts: 1462
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Connecticut
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Oooohh.....Gotta head to Lakeland and get some of dat "anointin'"! Nuttin' like some "fresh-firrrrrre"!
How anyone could even remotely think this is of God is beyond me! But, I'm sure the same people that fell for and flocked to the Brownsville and TACF freak shows, will head to Lakeland.
Just hearing the list of know heretics and false prophets this guy tosses around (Hinn, Cain, Branham, Kuhlman, Roberts) alone should raise red flags.
Spurgeon's quote in my sig below perfectly applies to this fiasco!
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"This would be the first step in apostasy; men first forget the true, and then adore the false.".......C.H. Spurgeon
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 10:23:53 AM
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wintery
Posts: 917
Joined: 2/1/2007
From: nw alabama
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: madalluge
quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
How many of you know this is wrong? If God heals, then you, I, we have nothing to do with it, we do not heal, God does. Todd has surrounded himself with Bob Jones and Paul Cain and expressed his admiration for Branham, Kuhlman, and Hinn. He's on the wrong track and the wrong understanding.
Problem is the Bible doesn't say that...Jesus said for you to heal the sick...
Matt 10:7-8 (NIV)
7As you go, preach this message: 'The kingdom of heaven is near.' 8Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy,[a]drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.
NASB
7"And as you go, preach, saying, '(A)The kingdom of heaven is at hand.'
8"Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out demons. Freely you received, freely give.
KJV
7And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
8Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.
Hello madalluge,
None of those verses is saying that we have power to do this apart from God. Just as to share about the kingdom of heaven is a work to do with God, not apart from God, so is healing and deliverance.
Now to get back to the context of that quote, here's the whole post:
quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
Todd Bentley: “If I paid the price like other great men & woman of God of history and the bible… could I walk in the presence of God like them?”
source is today's Stephen Strader bulletin
How many of you know this is wrong? If God heals, then you, I, we have nothing to do with it, we do not heal, God does. Todd has surrounded himself with Bob Jones and Paul Cain and expressed his admiration for Branham, Kuhlman, and Hinn. He's on the wrong track and the wrong understanding.
This post is about Todd Bentley's quote which shows he apparently thinks he can_do something_ about it. My old pastor (someone I would have a lot of questions for at this point) does evangelistic/healing meetings on a large scale, and he emphasizes that it is God who heals and that we should not think we have anything to do to make it happen.
I do not believe that as Christians we receive super-powers like a comic book. We work together with God as He leads us--we ask, and it is up to God how He will respond.
There is certainly not enough information in that quote alone to understand Bentley's thinking entirely. If you read the whole post in context I'm saying that altogether there are things I view as indications of a mistaken understanding. That would be bad enough, without the angel things, but there they are as well.
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 10:25:07 AM
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csl7037
Posts: 640
Joined: 3/24/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
Oooohh.....Gotta head to Lakeland and get some of dat "anointin'"! Nuttin' like some "fresh-firrrrrre"!
You don't have to travel to Lakeland. The night we watched, he annointed a bag of charcoal, just track down one of those briskets and I'm sure you'll be set!
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 10:46:23 AM
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wintery
Posts: 917
Joined: 2/1/2007
From: nw alabama
Status: offline
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"He shows up in meetings where I feel him standing beside me on my left."--Todd Bentley on his "angel".
Todd Bentley encounters with angels (runtime 9:27)
Posting dated July 2007 at TACF, Todd Bentley references Lake, Branham, Cain, Jones, Jackson, himself, angels and "a revival that will carry us into the second coming of Jesus".
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:04:34 PM
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pray4all
Posts: 345
Joined: 4/21/2008
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watched Him on godtv last night, probably heading down there for a week hopefully leaving tomorrow. have a great day
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:06:15 PM
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Anisavta
Posts: 707
Joined: 1/20/2008
From: Northern CA
Status: offline
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Why?
_____________________________
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first!
B'rachot,
Marsha
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:08:45 PM
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pray4all
Posts: 345
Joined: 4/21/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Anisavta
The issue is not in whether the L~rd heals or whether we are called to pray for the sick. Yes Yeshua still heals. Yes we are to pray for the sick and expect healings. Post after post reflects that.
The issue is whether or not we are to follow after the leadings of spirit guides or angels. The issue is whether or not Todd or anyone should make fools out of people by kneeing them in the stomach or pushing people down.
Every time in scripture where people were healed, or raised from the dead or had any kind of miracle happen for them, there was dignity. Dignity for the person touched and dignity for the person administering the blessing. Video after video I have watched of Mr Bentley dealing with people have been humiliating and degrading.
Even Benny Hinn conducts his services with a measure of dignity.
Mr Bentley almost has a WWF approach to dealing with people. Put him in a venue of a wrestling match and his actions would be the same as in his services.
seem to recall in the word, once the Lord used spittle to heal a blind person, would you consider that undignified, of course if i was blind, wouldn't matter to me if spittle was used or not
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:10:24 PM
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pray4all
Posts: 345
Joined: 4/21/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Anisavta
Why?
been praying for new teeth, and that is not a joke, can't eat food too well these days, and I believe God can give me new teeth
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:21:46 PM
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lw9
Posts: 1207
Joined: 7/22/2005
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pray4all:
God is too weak to do this if that is His will in your own home? He cannot heal you in your home town? Your church cannot pray for you with any effectiveness? God now requires you and others to go running after people to mediate a 'miracle' for you?
Since you're going to Lakeland, what will your testimony be should you not receive new teeth? How will you explain this, how will you explain the 'Lakeland miracles', and how will you explain Todd Bentley?
One other thought: Instead of spending money on this week long trip, what if you were to spend the money on a dentist?
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:29:57 PM
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lw9
Posts: 1207
Joined: 7/22/2005
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quote:
prophet: Last weekend Andrew Strom was interviewed on Watchmen
Radio concerning the Florida Healing revival (along with Matthew
Stephen). This may fill in some background for people. Please
take a listen.
Simply click on the link at the TOP RIGHT that says "FLORIDA
DECEPTION??" on the following website-
http://www.revivalschool.com
Thanks, prophet! Listening to it now. Execellent, excellent, excellent. Goes straight to the core, and the hosts do a great job of teaching on deception for the first half before the interview. I hope everyone will give this a serious listen, because it's worth it.
< Message edited by lw9 -- 5/12/2008 2:37:26 PM >
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:48:12 PM
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Anisavta
Posts: 707
Joined: 1/20/2008
From: Northern CA
Status: offline
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When Yeshua used spit - lets see how He did it:
Mar 7:32 And they brought a deaf one to Him, hardly speaking. And they begged Him to put His hand on him.
Mar 7:33 And He took him aside from the crowd and put His fingers into his ears. And He spat and touched his tongue.
Mar 7:34 And looking up to Heaven, He sighed and said to him, Ephphatha! (that is, Be opened!)
Mar 7:35 And instantly his ears were opened and the bond of his tongue was loosened, and he spoke plainly.
Mar 8:22 And He came to Bethsaida. And they brought a blind man to Him and begged Him to touch him.
Mar 8:23 And He took the blind man by the hand and led him out of the town. And when He had spat on his eyes and had put His hands on him, He asked Him if he saw anything.
Mar 8:24 And he looked up and said, I see men as trees, walking.
Mar 8:25 And after that He put His hands again on his eyes and made him look up. And he was restored and saw all clearly.
Joh 9:1 And passing by, He saw a man who was blind from birth.
Joh 9:2 And His disciples asked Him, saying, Master, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?
Joh 9:3 Jesus answered, Neither has this man nor his parents sinned, but that the works of God might be revealed in him.
Joh 9:4 I must work the works of Him who sent Me, while it is day. Night comes when no man can work.
Joh 9:5 As long as I am in the world, I am the Light of the world.
Joh 9:6 And when He had spoken these things, He spat on the ground and made clay from the spittle. And He anointed the eyes of the blind man with the clay.
Joh 9:7 And He said to him, Go, wash in the pool of Siloam (which translated is Sent). Therefore he went and washed and came seeing.
Why Messiah used spit - I'm not sure but notice how He did it. Did He collect a crowd? No He took the person away so it was private. The third incident was with His disciples not a mass over stimulated crowd of people. So yes it was very dignified.
I dread the day Todd uses this method of healing. I can just imagine how he would do it seeing his MO.
pray4all I know I or anyone here won't convince you that going for a teeth job is at best not the best idea. Good grief I could put a dentist into a new house or car with the work I need done. But for me to go somewhere to expect the Holy One (blessed be He) to make me happy by giving me gold teeth would be very presumptious. You are in my opinion tempting G~d.
So lets say you go and you come back with the same lousey teeth? What will that do to you? Will you still praise G~d that you are fearfully and wonderfully made or will you be angry with Him. Are you spiritually discerning enough to know the enemy camp when you encounter it or will you also accept some spirit guide to run your life?
Just questions for you to take before the L~rd before you venture out.
_____________________________
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first!
B'rachot,
Marsha
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 2:59:35 PM
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tspencley
Posts: 15
Joined: 3/21/2008
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quote:
First off, I know SAM FROM WASHINGTON WITH 4 GOLD TEETH. I have seen them with my own eyes. He had recently been to the dentist and was going to have some pretty extensive dental work. The gold teeth are real and not only are they real but they are solid down to the root. This according to his own dentist. And perfectly molded to the teeth above.
I really do not see why any of you are afraid of the revival in Florida other than you are scared. There are manifestations of the holy spirit that seem a little out of the box when seen from an outsider perspective or when our personal inhibitions take over.
I know I used to look at people annointed with laughter and think I know that is a real thing, but it is not for me. I am not going to be laughing lady on the front pew. But that changed a few weeks ago. I was overcome with completely uncontrolable laughter and joy that goes way beyond anything any of you have experienced. This happened after some intense prayer with a small group of individuals. If you knew me and how reserved I was you would know this was absolutley the real thing. There is no way I would have made a spectacle out of myself just because.
This is not an emotional wave people are riding. This is real. And the 1 Million dollar offering was to keep the airing going worldwide for the next 40 days. And that is only a quarter of what is needed. If you think Todd is getting wealthy off of this you have got to be kidding me.
I have not seen alot of discussion, just a lot of bashing. Try out the Holy Spirit. He will not force himself on you, you must be willing and accepting, and that is why when we pray we will often give the holy spirit freedom to work. If you all remember God gave all of us free will and we need to be open to allowing him to work in us and through us. And there may be some bending and breaking of things we used to think inportant.
amen i couldn't have said it better myself. i was debating on whether i should even post on this or not. thought i would just be wasting my time. i have looked through this forum and after 8 pages i am impressed with the number of posts some of the same people put up. im sure God is impressed with that spirit of bashing. i didn't think that was one of the fruits, ill have to reread galatians. first off some people are afraid of the holy spirit because it doesn't fit into that box they have God in. they would rather sit in a pew, walkout and leave church the same way they went in. if you read the lords prayer those words are meant to be taken literally. i could go on and on about this, but why bother.
wonders if this was even a waste of time. jesus said we would do much greater things i wonder what he meant? as far as this revival, i will wait and inspect the fruit.
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 3:03:05 PM
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earthless
Posts: 4829
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where bbq pigeons roast....
Status: online
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tspencley,
How do you know this is a genuine movement of the Holy Spirit?
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 3:08:05 PM
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Anisavta
Posts: 707
Joined: 1/20/2008
From: Northern CA
Status: offline
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quote:
as far as this revival, i will wait and inspect the fruit.
What do you do with the videos of the services that have been posted? What fruit do you see so far? What do you do with an angel calling itself Emma? What do you do with people being pushed down and kneed in the stomach? How would you handle being pushed down and having someone yell over you BAM BAM BAM or supposedly the gift of tongues spoken as BLAH BLAH BLAH? Explain this fruit to me please.
_____________________________
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first!
B'rachot,
Marsha
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 3:10:55 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2165
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline
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quote:
ill have to reread galatians
Gal 5:22 - 23 (ESV) 22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness, [b]self-control; against such things there is no law.
How does bodies hitting the floor fit into this passage?
Matt 7:22 - 23 (ESV) 22On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
and this passage
2 Thess 2:9 - 12 (ESV) 9The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, 10and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, 12in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
_____________________________
The grace of God is infinite and eternal. As it had no beginning, so it can have no end, and being an attribute of God, it is as boundless as infinitude.
A. W. Tozer (1897–1963)
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RE: Florida HealingOutpouring-here we go again - 5/12/2008 3:15:21 PM
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earthless
Posts: 4829
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where bbq pigeons roast....
Status: online
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I suspect it will be another "hit and run" poster.... adds nothing to the discussion and absolutely ignores all of the documentation and discussion that has already taken place.
It's dishonest and of ill character.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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