RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (Full Version)

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jazzact13 -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 12:56:49 PM)

quote:

I recycled, that counts does it not. I am a conservative recycler. I wonder how many of my liberal brothers and sister who worry about the environment also recycle? No comdenation, just wondering.


Ah, haven't you figured out by now, that when liberals say they want everyone to do something, that means they want everyone else to do it, while they do whatever they want?



lightshineon -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 12:59:33 PM)

That is what I am wondering, Al Gore, Hillary, and Obama, do they recycle?
quote:

ORIGINAL: jazzact13

quote:

I recycled, that counts does it not. I am a conservative recycler. I wonder how many of my liberal brothers and sister who worry about the environment also recycle? No comdenation, just wondering.


Ah, haven't you figured out by now, that when liberals say they want everyone to do something, that means they want everyone else to do it, while they do whatever they want?



Lizahana -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 1:21:48 PM)

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ORIGINAL: stamper_ben

[:)] Aw, thank you Liz. You're pretty good too.

For a resident of the vast frozen northern stretches...[:D]


Frozen is right! We just started thaw out only ~1.5-2 weeks ago (yes - we still had snow on the ground only that short while ago) ...in mid-April.

That coupled with Favre retiring would make me move, except I have to stick around for my mom.

We could have used a little global warming this winter! Ha ha! You know I'm jokin'! See, I have a sense of humor!)

Take care, Peace and God bless,



stamper_ben -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 1:28:28 PM)

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We could have used a little global warming this winter!
Wishful thinking on your and Al Gore's part I suspect.[:D]



davemiller7 -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 4:32:08 PM)

To celebrate "Earth Day," I drove an extra 20 miles each way - to and from work, at 15 mph over the speed limit. Before I left in the morning, I turned on all the lights in the house, the tv, stereo, etc. and left them on all day. I turned on the air conditioner and set it as low as I could, turned on the range and oven.

When I got home I had two speeding tickets and the house had burned down. I'm not going to celebrate "Earth Day anymore.

-Dave, bitter and clinging to my guns and religion



colliefan -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 4:32:37 PM)

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What complaint do you all have against Earth Day? And you know...keeping the Earth sustainable for future generations?


The worship of the Earth instead of its Creator.



colliefan -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 4:46:27 PM)

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The purpose of Earth Day is to remind us that we are stewards for the future kids on this planet. Again, if some don't want to do their part, I feel bad - but it makes me want to do more.


Nope. The purpose of Earth Day was to deify the planet (i.e. Mother Earth) and to denegrate man. To reduce him to just one of the many species on the planet. This is how we are to treat the planet


Gen 1:28 - 31 (ESV) 28And God blessed them. And God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and and have dominion over the fisubdue it sh of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over every living thing that moves on the earth.” 29And God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit. You shall have them for food. 30And to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the heavens and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has the breath of life, I have given every green plant for food.” And it was so. 31And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.



PrincessDonna -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 5:29:25 PM)

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Hug a tree, then cut that sucker down for firewood.


LOL! Sounds just up our alley![:D]

Earth Day does not have to be about worshiping the earth instead of the Creator. The Christian school used the day to talk about some ways we can be responsible with the planet God has given us, then they cleaned up the school grounds and got the planters ready for flowers (too early here still). I talked with my 3 year old about Creation and how God gave us dominion over the earth and all that is in it. Then more on her level, we talked about why we don't throw our lollipop wrapper on the ground on the walk home from the post office.[8|]



Sartrian -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 6:45:33 PM)

This thread is full of mixed messages. If the entire first page was a joke, then that's all well and good. I'm a big enough man to realize when I haven't gotten a joke. But then you have people like SonInMe1 and stamper_ben who mutter under their breath "socialists...and their agenda," and "Drill in Alaska!"

And there's this odd preoccupation with Al Gore being some kind of messianic figure for environmentalists. He's just the most visible public figure advocating for enviromental politics and personal standards regarding interaction with nature. He doesn't speak for the trees, I'm afraid.

(Oh, and Human greenhouse gas emission has been accepted as the cause of the mean warming of the Earth by thirty-two scientific panels that are spread all over the world. The evidence, their unanimous agreement, and the simple correlation between cause and effect seems like as good a reason as any to begin examining our personal standards of environmental protection, and our nation's political stances on the sustainability of Earth, StephK.)



Sartrian -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 6:49:07 PM)

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The worship of the Earth instead of its Creator.


Gaylord Nelson was a Methodist, I'm afraid. His worship was constrained to the same being you worship. Do you have any other specific examples as to why Earth Day would be objectionable?



Jhud -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 6:53:39 PM)

Personally I find Earth Day offensive because it is, like many liberal activites, one of those things that allows one to feel good about oneself without actually doing anything substantive at all.

Sort of like a 'Save Tibet' rally.



Sartrian -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 6:57:06 PM)

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Personally I find Earth Day offensive because it is, like many liberal activites, one of those things that allows one to feel good about oneself without actually doing anything substantive at all.

Sort of like a 'Save Tibet' rally.


I...partially agree with you. Earth Day is a good idea on paper, but in practice, it does make many people feel as if they've "saved the enviroment" in participating in a day that's meant to make people aware of their environmental impact for the rest of the year.

It becomes, for many, an excuse. "I'm allowed to have an SUV because I went to the Earth Day festival in [insert town here]!"



colliefan -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 7:19:51 PM)

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I'm allowed to have an SUV because I went to the Earth Day festival in [insert town here]!"


more like I just bought some carbon credits to pay for my sins against the enivorment. St. Al lives in the largest home in his home state and flys in a fuel-inefficent private jet. This thread was started tounge in check but the fact is there is serious economic hardship based solely on junk science.

Here we are facing the remaking of a lifestyle. In other parts of the world people face a life crisis b/c they do not have food to eat. Food that would have gone to the food chain has now gone to the energy chain despite the proven fact that corn based ethanol takes more energy to produce than it produces. People that say the care about the earth and its poor just want to worship the lie.

Rom 1:22 - 23 (ESV) Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.



Sartrian -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 9:31:06 PM)

So what happened to Earth Day being some kind of evil pagan festival? You abandoned that argument pretty quickly to rail against "junk science" and "St. Al."

1. Environmentalists don't worship Al Gore. He's a human being with flaws like the rest of us, but at least he's trying to promote the message that the Earth, at the rate we're destroying it, will be unable to make a turn-around if we don't do something about it.

2. Which junk science is causing economic catastrophe in the Third World?



stamper_ben -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 10:28:39 PM)

quote:

This thread is full of mixed messages. If the entire first page was a joke, then that's all well and good. I'm a big enough man to realize when I haven't gotten a joke. But then you have people like SonInMe1 and stamper_ben who mutter under their breath "socialists...and their agenda," and "Drill in Alaska!"
Tell you what - I ain't muttering it under my breath!

What isn't socialist about taking even more of our money and redistributing it to a global entity that we have no control over?

What is wrong with buying more time to develope an alternative to oil by using the resource of oil that is under a postage stamp sized piece of ANWR while breaking the ties with OPEC?



colliefan -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 10:38:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sartrian

So what happened to Earth Day being some kind of evil pagan festival? You abandoned that argument pretty quickly to rail against "junk science" and "St. Al."

1. Environmentalists don't worship Al Gore. He's a human being with flaws like the rest of us, but at least he's trying to promote the message that the Earth, at the rate we're destroying it, will be unable to make a turn-around if we don't do something about it.

2. Which junk science is causing economic catastrophe in the Third World?


If environmentalist don't worship St. Al, why was he given both an Oscar for best lie and a Nobel Peace Prize? Why did a British court rule that a disclaimer must be presented before his infomercial is shown?

We are NOT destroying the earth. The earth is simply going through its normal warming and cooling cycles. How does one explain the midevil warming cycle where Greenland was warm enough to grow grapes and the gasoline engine wouldn't be invented for centuries.

The only thing Gore and his minions want people to do is to reduce their life styles while he lives in opulances and pays indulgences in the form of carbon credits, To firms that he has stake in also.

The move to ethanol has taken an ingrediant that was primary used in the food chain and moved it to the energy chain despite the fact it takes more energy to produce a gallon to ethanol than it produces. Look what has happend to the wheat and rice markets b/c of this government mandated move.

These individuals hate capitalism and the good it produces. If one wants to see what socialism has produced visit Eastern Europe and Russia. It isn't pretty.



colliefan -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 10:44:07 PM)

In terms of drilling in ANWAR, the land itself is the size of SC and the propsed drilling site is the size of Regan National Airport and the drilling would only be for several months of the year. And no polar bears would be hurt during the drilling. And don't forget a number of scenes from St. Al's movie were faked. But according to dan blather, intent matters more than the truth.



Sartrian -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/23/2008 11:46:07 PM)

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What isn't socialist about taking even more of our money and redistributing it to a global entity that we have no control over?


And which "global entity we have no control over" are we talking about in this context?

quote:

What is wrong with buying more time to develope an alternative to oil by using the resource of oil that is under a postage stamp sized piece of ANWR while breaking the ties with OPEC?


Well, other than the fact that it's a band-aid over necrosis, and that if we broke from OPEC, using the ANWR as our sole source of oil, it would last between 215 and 525 days, and that turning protected park land into industry is a slippery slope in the eyes of most environmentalists?

Not a thing.

quote:

If environmentalist don't worship St. Al, why was he given both an Oscar for best lie and a Nobel Peace Prize? Why did a British court rule that a disclaimer must be presented before his infomercial is shown?


1. The Oscar was for a documentary that helped to ring the alarm bell that we are trapping the Earth under a cloud of gasses that trap heat inside, slowly killing us all, and our descendants?
2. The Nobel Peace Prize was awarded by a panel of judges, not a gang of environmentalists that managed to burst their way into Oslo with guns blazing. Plus, if the environment collapses, then resources will become more scarce, provoking more conflict. The idea behind the awarding was simple-- by bringing environmentalism to the public's attenton, Gore and the IPCC helped to promote a world where resources are less scarce and conflict over them is lessened.
3. I've never heard that. You'll have to give me more information than that.

quote:

We are NOT destroying the earth. The earth is simply going through its normal warming and cooling cycles. How does one explain the midevil warming cycle where Greenland was warm enough to grow grapes and the gasoline engine wouldn't be invented for centuries.


Other than the fact that our current period of warming is substantially higher than the Medieval Warm Period, and that said MWP was not a global event, and that studies have found that greenhouse gasses (of which CO2 and methane are) increase the temperature of the planet by blocking heat inside the atmosphere, and that the mean temperature of the Earth in just the last hundred years has increased by 1.35 degrees farenheit?

quote:

The only thing Gore and his minions want people to do is to reduce their life styles while he lives in opulances and pays indulgences in the form of carbon credits, To firms that he has stake in also.


Carbon credits are a brilliant idea. It mixes environmentalism with capitalism. If you want the luxuries that destroy the environment, you ought to have to pay for them. Also, your Gore-bashing is rather outdated by this point.

"In February 2007, critics stated that "a report by the Nashville Electric Service revealed that Mr Gore's mansion in Nashville consumed between 12 and 20 times more electricity than the average family home and that his electricity consumption had risen since the film's release in 2005." WKRN-TV reported that the Gore family obtains their power from the Nashville Electric Service's "renewable energy initiative", The Green Power Switch program. The Detroit Free Press also noted that "Gore purchased 108 blocks of 'green power' for each of the past three months, according to a summary of the bills. That’s a total of $432 a month Gore paid extra for solar or other renewable energy sources.The green power Gore purchased is equivalent to recycling 2.48 million aluminum cans or 286,092 pounds of newspaper, according to comparison figures on NES’s Web site." The Associated Press reported on 13 December 2007 that Gore "has completed a host of improvements to make the home more energy efficient, and a building-industry group has praised the house as one of the nation's most environmentally friendly [...] 'Short of tearing it down and staring anew, I don't know how it could have been rated any higher,' said Kim Shinn of the U.S. Green Building Council, which gave the house its second-highest rating for sustainable design."

quote:

The move to ethanol has taken an ingrediant that was primary used in the food chain and moved it to the energy chain despite the fact it takes more energy to produce a gallon to ethanol than it produces. Look what has happend to the wheat and rice markets b/c of this government mandated move.


Well, I agree with you on that. Plus, the fertilizers used on the corn have traveled into the Gulf of Mexico, making the dead zone even worse. But then, don't blame this on Gore. Blame this on our Dear Leader's incompetence regarding anything that would be good for the environment.

quote:

These individuals hate capitalism and the good it produces. If one wants to see what socialism has produced visit Eastern Europe and Russia. It isn't pretty.


Carbon credits are an example of applied capitalism. Sorry. You lose.



Jhud -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 12:22:06 AM)

quote:

Carbon credits are an example of applied capitalism.


And how are they working so far? To actually change the amount of emissions, that is?



blessedinnyc -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 12:26:42 AM)

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ORIGINAL: Sartrian
He doesn't speak for the trees, I'm afraid.

LOL. I can't get the image of Al as The Lorax out of my head, now.

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In terms of drilling in ANWAR, the land itself is the size of SC and the propsed drilling site is the size of Regan National Airport and the drilling would only be for several months of the year. And no polar bears would be hurt during the drilling. And don't forget a number of scenes from St. Al's movie were faked. But according to dan blather, intent matters more than the truth.

Because this way, we get to have our cake and eat it, too. Long-term futures on oil are probably $1-$2 lower because ANWR exists. If oil prices ever get too high, we can always drill there. So with ANWR, we get to enjoy lower oil prices without even having to drill!



Boofhead -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 2:27:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sartrian

(If I even dare to ask...)

What complaint do you all have against Earth Day? And you know...keeping the Earth sustainable for future generations?


Simple. The Earth is an inanimate object. We do not worship it nor are we accountable to it. It is going to be here longer then you and I. If you are worried about the future generations, then start praying for their salvation. God is going to create a new heaven and a new Earth while this Earth will be destroyed.



Lizahana -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 7:33:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: colliefan

quote:

The purpose of Earth Day is to remind us that we are stewards for the future kids on this planet. Again, if some don't want to do their part, I feel bad - but it makes me want to do more.


Nope. The purpose of Earth Day was to deify the planet (i.e. Mother Earth) and to denegrate man. To reduce him to just one of the many species on the planet. This is how we are to treat the planet


Gen 1:28 - 31 (ESV) 28And God blessed them. And God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and and have dominion over the fisubdue it sh of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over every living thing that moves on the earth.” 29And God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit. You shall have them for food. 30And to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the heavens and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has the breath of life, I have given every green plant for food.” And it was so. 31And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.


colliefan - are you an historian of Earth Day? Please explain what qualifies you to be an authority on Earth Day. Senator Gaylord Nelson started it to make people aware of environmental problems. This link has Sen Nelson's OWN words about why he started it - it may or may not be of particular interest to you: http://earthday.envirolink.org/history.html.

Genesis 2:15 And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.

Psalm 24:1 The earth [is] the LORD'S, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein.

Now, God created the earth - the earth is His. Not only this, but in Genesis 2:15 He commands us to keep, or take care of His creation. I am going to do everything I can to take care of this gift. If you think otherwise - good for you and good luck.

And golly gee - what is so evil about wanting to curb toxic fumes that cause ill health? What is so evil about wanting to prevent the pollutants that bring on asthma attacks in children?

I have asthma and live near Milwaukee, WI. As a child, I would not be able to play outside during ozone days. And it was pretty rare for a child to have asthma when I was growing up. Now, I don't care about myself - I care about the increased incidence of asthma cases and the more acuteness of them. I have 1 nephew and my friend has a nephew that have to use nebulizers! I've only had to use inhalers.

And what is so hard about recycling? For goodness sake, my grandmother and her generation recycled during the wars and did they complain about it? No, they just did it.

Mmmmm...and I almost forgot - you do know that alternative energy is a good thing as well, correct? You know - if we don't have to depend on oil...perhaps little men would not have to go to foreign lands to start ill-conceived wars.

I will never understand this reluctance and sometimes refusal on the part of some evangelicals on this topic. Not only does God call us to be good stewards; but keeping the earth clear of pollutants keeps our children healthy!

Peace and God bless,



SonInMe1 -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 8:09:50 AM)

quote:

But then you have people like SonInMe1 and stamper_ben


Thank you for putting me in such good company and I called environmentalists socialists because they are. All of their solutions involve socialism and their garnering more power...and if Al has his way, more money.

quote:

He's just the most visible public figure advocating for enviromental politics and personal standards regarding interaction with nature


Nope. He is trying to control more people with government and to enrichen himself in the process.

quote:

Personally I find Earth Day offensive because it is, like many liberal activites, one of those things that allows one to feel good about oneself without actually doing anything substantive at all.


amen and amen

quote:

How does one explain the midevil warming cycle where Greenland was warm enough to grow grapes and the gasoline engine wouldn't be invented for centuries.


All those methane producing farm animals of course.

quote:

our current period of warming is substantially higher than the Medieval Warm Period


I haven't heard anything about Al buying shoreline property in Greenland.



Pat-rebel_lady -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 10:06:14 AM)

quote:

I will never understand this reluctance and sometimes refusal on the part of some evangelicals on this topic.

quote:

Personally I find Earth Day offensive because it is, like many liberal activites, one of those things that allows one to feel good about oneself without actually doing anything substantive at all.

I also find "Earth Day" offensive.
Lizahana, your link provided this information:
"The EnviroLink Network is a non-profit organization which has been providing access to thousands of online environmental resources since 1991." (highlight mine)

We acknowledge 'Arbor Day' :
The first Arbor Day took place on April 10, 1872 in Nebraska. It was the brainchild of Julius Sterling Morton (1832-1902), a Nebraska journalist and politician originally from Michigan. Throughout his long and productive career, Morton worked to improve agricultural techniques in his adopted state and throughout the United States when he served as President Grover Cleveland's Secretary of Agriculture. But his most important legacy is Arbor Day.
Morton felt that Nebraska's landscape and economy would benefit from the wide-scale planting of trees. He set an example himself planting orchards, shade trees and wind breaks on his own farm and he urged his neighbours to follow suit. Morton's real opportunity, though, arrived when he became a member of Nebraska's state board of agriculture. He proposed that a special day be set aside dedicated to tree planting and increasing awareness of the importance of trees. Nebraska's first Arbor Day was an amazing success. More than one million trees were planted. A second Arbor Day took place in 1884 and the young state made it an annual legal holiday in 1885, using April 22nd to coincide with Morton's birthday.
In the years following that first Arbor Day, Morton's idea spread beyond Nebraska with Kansas, Tennessee, Minnesota and Ohio all proclaiming their own Arbor Days. Today all 50 states celebrate Arbor Day although the dates may vary in keeping with the local climate. (State Arbor Days) At the federal level, in 1970, President Richard Nixon proclaimed the last Friday in April as National Arbor Day.
More HERE
(highlight mine)

Please Note the words: "He set an example himself planting orchards, shade trees and wind breaks on his own farm and he urged his neighbours to follow suit."

For myself, I've just never been thrilled with those that steal and take credit for someone else's ideas and work. And then change the name and turn it into a profit making business; Al Gore, IMHO.



davemiller7 -> RE: Earth Day How should we celebrate? (4/24/2008 12:00:45 PM)

IMHO (others have expressed this same opinion also), anyone who thinks that mankind can destroy, or restore, the earth has an awfully high opinion of him(her)self. The earth has been through warming and cooling cycles several times during its existence. Evidence of lush vegetation has been found under the ice in either Iceland or Greenland, please pardon that I don't have the evidence in front of me, it is one of the two.

And why is it necessarily bad that the earth is warming? It might mean more and better crops!

Not to worry about the polar bears and penguins, they seem to be quite adaptable.

And cows have probably had the problem with flatulence ever since they appeared on earth, so I don't think that can be that much of a problem these days.

Global warming and its many offshoots is a great money maker and cause for more government control over our lives, though.

-Dave



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