Mr. Sadman here... (Full Version)

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UBarW -> Mr. Sadman here... (4/21/2008 1:54:09 AM)

Well, not totally sad. I am married to a wonderful girl, for nearly 25 years now. We've been through some tough times, and many good times.

What I am sad about, is the shift in our relationship with regards to affection. She really doesnt seem to need it, and I do.

I have written this post a dozen times, always cancelling before posting. I just dont know where to go...

She a wonderful woman... I just wonder if she needs me like I need her.

http://www.crosswalk.com/1363329/
my study guide for the next few days of self examination.



AnnieLaurieLie -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/21/2008 7:31:56 AM)

Hi. You sound like my husband.

The problem with us is that when he says "affection" he means hugs, kisses, verbally telling him that I love him or complimenting him on his appearance, calling him during the day to say hello and that I am thinking of him, etc. I don't tend to think that way and am not naturally affectionate in those ways. Nor do I feel affection from him doing those things to or for me.

To me, affection is spending time talking to me, and really talking to me, not with one eye on the game on TV. It doesn't have to be a serious conversation, but the total attention and focus is affection to me. Or things like helping me with the dishes or other chores around the house, without being asked. He isn't so much into any of that. I can see where he'd say I don't need affection because I don't define affection the same way he does. And he is surprised that I consider these things as showing affection.

Of course, we're a little strained right now and I'm not showing him affection or taking it well from him either way because he cheated on me, so we have that issue to deal with. Take it from me, affairs really dampen one's desire to be affectionate with the cheater.

But, if we make it through this and stay together, I will make more of an effort to be affectionate to him in the way he means it. I assume he'd do the same for me.

Point is, do you guys define affection the same way?

Iwillfearnoevil would no doubt recommend that you guys fill out the emotional needs questionnaire on Dr. Harley's marriagebuilders.com web site to start a discussion with your wife on this topic, to kind of see where you're at.



imageoftheinvisible -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/21/2008 8:30:38 AM)

What are your wife's needs? I believe wives are much more inclined to meet their husbands needs when they feel like their needs are being attended to.

I recommend that you read the book, "The Five Love Languages" by Gary Chapman. In the book, he talks about how spouses have different needs or love languages, and how discovering each other's love language is a very important. Once you and your both realize each other's specific love language, it makes it easier for you both to meet those needs.

It sounds as though you are craving affection and feel rejected because your need is not receiving the attention it deserves. If you focus on meeting your wife's needs, I am very confident she will focus on yours. It is difficult when both spouses feel neglected because neither wants to step up and meet the other person's needs. I feel it is the husband's job to step up in times like these and love your wife and Jesus loves the church.



iwillfearnoevil -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/21/2008 10:03:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnnieLaurieLie
Iwillfearnoevil would no doubt recommend that you guys fill out the emotional needs questionnaire on Dr. Harley's marriagebuilders.com web site to start a discussion with your wife on this topic, to kind of see where you're at.


thanks annie, maybe i could take today off? :)

sadman - do you mean affection as in your spouse communicating to you that "you are important to her, will care for you, and be there for you" or are you talking about sex?



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/21/2008 10:05:20 AM)

I am a guy that tries very hard to meet her needs. We dont have the one eye on the tv thing happening, as she "drive" ;-) most of the time. I participate in the household chores, such as cooking all the meals, doing the grocery shopping, all the shuttling of our son, etc.

I did read the 5 languages book, and asked her to read it, but she hasnt been willing to do so. Not sure why. I made sure that she knew that my reason for reading it was to learn better how to communicate in her way.

She was raised in a household didnt do much in the way that I express affection. When we were in the early part of our marriage, she was more expressive. I guess thats what I dont get, what changed.

I have only been asking for compromise, I know that it will never be like we were 25 years ago-thats just not realistic. I just want to be need emotionally from time to time. We havent made love or even slept in the same room for nearly three years-but its not about sex, really-its about emotional connection. She likes the noise of the tv, so she sleeps in the living room.

Last week, I told her she was beautiful. She scowled and said I embarrass her when I say things like that. We were alone in our house... I dont get it.

Please understand, I am just trying to learn how to live with this situation. I accept that she probably is doing all that she can do, maybe it will change, maybe not. I wont ask her to be something that she isnt comfortable with, I would really, however, like to know how to live with myself. How to accept the difference without being sad, lonely, or disappointed.



imageoftheinvisible -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/21/2008 10:36:29 PM)

Your last paragraph seems like you are saying that you hope you can be as distant from affection as your wife seems to be. Your heart is saying something is wrong because something is wrong...Your needs are not being met or even considered. As a result, you feel an emotion like sadness, lonliness, or disappointment.

It seems like there is also a reason your wife is so distant, whether that reason be an affair, sexual abuse, physical abuse, an addiction, etc. She goes to the extreme of sleeping in a separate room for a reason.

I'm glad you have read the "Five Love Languages" book. Have you identified your wife's love langauge? If so, you know exactly what things will cause her to feel love from you. I would encourage you to continue to meet her needs, speaking her Love Language, and praying that God would open her heart to more affection and love. God can really work in her heart as you are loving her each day.



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 12:19:56 AM)

What ghosts are there in the past? Plenty.

She is an abuse survivor-was being beaten regularly when we met. 7 years of it. I used to drink, but that has been 14 years now-I quit as a choice, no handcuffs[:D]. I didnt want my boys growing up remembering me with alcohol o on my breath. At that time, it would have eventually killed the marriage, if I didnt quit. I dont smoke, I dont drink, and I dont chase women. I do my share, and then some, of the household stuff. I work hard, then come home, and do nothing outside the house other than occassional afternoon rides on my motorcycle, by myself, touring the coast.

We have a lot of debt, which stresses her. She says its the stress of work and all that causes the need for the noise of the tv.

When I say that I am trying to learn to live with the situation, I am saying that I dont want to be angry. She is wonderful in many ways. This is hurting me, but I need to be right about how I deal with this.

Sure, I would like her to 'turn around' and become demonstrative, and open. But that isnt likely. If there is a change to be made, it needs to be in me, as thats the only thing thats really in my span of control, right? Even so, its His will that will drive all this.

I posted hoping that there might be a new tip or two, that perhaps I can have more than just my prayers be heard for us.



Hislittleone -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 4:15:16 AM)

It sounds like your wife has emotionally checked out of the relationship. There are many things that could explain it.

I suggest you read Understanding the Mind of a Woman by Ken Nair and Man of Her Dreams/Woman of His by Joel and Kathy Davisson. They will give you a better understanding of a woman's heart. My husband and I have read both of the Davisson books and are currently reading Ken Nair. They have helped our marriage in a big way.

Ken Nair says that very often when a wife is hurting in her marriage (because of the husbands actions) the man is completely unaware of it. I really think it may help you figure a lot of this out. It can be a hard book for a man to read because it places most of the responsiblity on the husbands. But a happy marriage is worth it, right? [:)]

If your wife was more open and affectionate in the beginning, it leads me to wonder if perhaps you did some things intentionally/unitentionally that caused her great pain and her way of dealing was to withdraw. Just a thought. [&:]

What have been her chief complaints about your relationship as a whole? That would be a good place to start, I think.



maddog4god -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 6:15:21 AM)

Abuse recovery is very difficult and frightening. And frankly, it seems so illogical to base adult decisions on lies you "learned" as a child. It is likely she perceives your wants as pressures that she is not good enough. It may be helpful to her and you if you focus on the things that she does do "right".

Pray for her frequently. Ask God to bring people into her life that she can trust who will love her unconditionally so that God can gently float those issues to the surface for her to face. It's not that you are not good enough to do the job - you are too close and to disclose those things to you and then have to face you daily would be humilating to her in all likelyhood.

You are in a tough spot no doubt, but God is bigger then everything.



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 9:59:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hislittleone
dealing was to withdraw. Just a thought. [&:]

What have been her chief complaints about your relationship as a whole? That would be a good place to start, I think.


She has told me on a number of occasions, that as long as we dont argue, she is content.

I made a commitment some time ago, to myself, and to her that I will not argue with her. I cannot stand the "poisoned" feeling that I feel for yelling at someone i care about. Its my goal to make it to my deathbead without yelling at anyone.

thank you all for your input.



SingHisPraise -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 10:04:03 AM)

You say you have been married for 25 years, have you considered the fact that this also may be physical. She could be going through menipause (sp), it could be hormonal, or any number of physical problems. (Not to mention emotional) Maybe you should consider asking her to have a check up with her doctor. Just a thought[8|]



Memaw. -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 12:10:37 PM)

I was thinking the same thing as singhispraise.

Womens' hormones fluctuate beginning as early as their 30s and as a woman in her mid 40s, I can testify that they will make you act just as you describe your wife.

Please encourage her to have a complete health checkup.

>>HERE<< is a link to Peri-Menopause and Menopause Support Thread that you can read but can't post in (it's in Women Only). You may find that a lot of what your wife is going through could be attributed to that.



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 12:23:03 PM)

She had surgery 5 years ago, and we are very aware of the implications.

This concern of mine predates the surgery, though.

What I really want is to find a way to open her heart to the joy of sharing this type of bond.

If we never have sex again, its ok. I just want us to share all the other stuff. I have so much to offer her, I would like it to be a two way street...



Memaw. -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 12:30:57 PM)

I apologize for my assumption.

Continue to pray for your wife, and continue to ask God to show you how to reach her heart.

Blessings.



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 12:45:15 PM)

Theres no need to apologize... Its so hard to communicate this way, there's no way for you to have known...

I really thank all of you, I know you would like to help.

Perhaps someday I can be of help to you, too...
[;)]



Memaw. -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 12:55:48 PM)

Would she be willing to go to a counselor with you?

She was raised in a family who didn't express affection much and was beaten.
She is also stressed from debt and work.

It sounds to me like maybe she is in a "protective mode".

Emotionally she has protected herself so no further damage can happen to her.
Has she ever dealt with the abuse that happened to her?



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 1:15:26 PM)

In my opinion, no, she hasnt dealt with the abuse. That too me sounds like the protective mode.

We have done counseling several times, for some reason it never gets to the abuse.

My time with her overlapped the abuse years by about a year. I saw the after affects of what happened to her-I cannot understand how someone could NOT be changed by that.



Memaw. -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 1:33:52 PM)

Do you have a pastor that you could both go to and continue going until the abuse is dealt with?

Have you ever heard of a condition in horses called proud flesh?

In case you haven't, it is when a horse receives an injury to itself.
The injury appears to heal over and make a scar, but every time the horse rubs against that same spot, it bursts open and must heal again. Each time the injury takes longer and longer to heal. To truly fix this problem, the vet has to remove the original injury, excise the proud flesh, causing much discomfort for the horse and then new flesh can grow and create a strong, healthy area.

We do that emotionally.
We bury things within us, allow a "scar" to grow over it and think we are ok.
But something will "bump" up against our proud flesh and cause it to burst open again. This happens time after time until we excise that old wound and allow it to heal properly.

I hope this is making sense.



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 2:09:29 PM)

Very interesting way of putting it. I have heard of it, as a former rancher...

We have not been regular church goers-I am currently going alone. I have asked her if she feels a need to talk to someone about her past-she has told me repeatedly that she is fine... hmmm.


So tell me... what should I read out of this... My employer is struggling. There has been 4 rounds of layoffs, and I have survived them all (I must be doing something right...) but due to the uncertainty I have been looking for a different position. One hot prospect, would mean moving to another city. Our house 3 years away from being ready to sell, so the plan would be to take a room up there 4 nights a week. I commented to her "I am terrified that a move to there would drive us further apart..." She said nothing... literally nothing. I dont know what I expected her to say, but nothing worried me.



Memaw. -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 3:04:57 PM)

I think that may be another "protection" she has built.
If she shows you no emotion, she can't get hurt.

I really wish she would go for counseling, it surely sounds as though she needs someone to help work out some issues that she may not even know are still there.

Will she go to church with you?



imageoftheinvisible -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 3:13:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: UBarW


We have done counseling several times, for some reason it never gets to the abuse.



Ideally, your wife would agree to go to marital therapy; however, since she is dealing with a huge, underlying issue of abuse, she needs to work through that individually with you supporting her along the way. It would be difficult for a therapist to address the abuse in a marital therapy setting because that setting is used to address marital issues. Before your marital issues can be addressed, your wife's history of abuse (physical and emotional) need to be addressed and worked through.



UBarW -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 3:37:00 PM)

I think I am having one of those days...

Its like throwing something against a wall, but it wont stick...

all dressed up, and nowhere to go...

all this love, and I feel like I cant share it...


Yesterday, I sent her a "just because" love electronic greeting. I got an email back, with a thank you in the subject line, with an empty body section.

I keep trying to share, and to lead by example. Some days its hard to keep trying.

today is one of those days...[sm=icon_smile_cry.gif]



3tulips -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 3:38:38 PM)

I have been married for 25 years also, I can't imagine a marriage without the sex. I think it is time for a heart-to-heart and to spell it out just like you did to us. Is she willing to go out once a week for a date night?



iwillfearnoevil -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 3:43:28 PM)

date night is a good idea. does she have any hobbies? think back many years of marriage?



Memaw. -> RE: Mr. Sadman here... (4/22/2008 5:18:26 PM)

I agree with the date night thing.
Surprise her with something so out of the ordinary that maybe you will get a reaction.[:)]



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