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explain apparent conflict - 6/24/2008 11:08:53 PM
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colliefan
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\Isa 42:8 (ESV) 8 I am the LORD; that is my name; my glory I give to no other, nor my praise to carved idols.
\Isa 48:11 (ESV) 11 For my own sake, for my own sake, I do it, for how should my name£ be profaned? My glory I will not give to another.
John 17:22 (ESV) 22 The glory that you have given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one,
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RE: explain apparent conflict - 6/25/2008 2:28:01 AM
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BibleL7
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No conflict when you look at being one with makes it not sharing with another but with one you are one with. Simpler, the Father is one with Jesus and one with the Holy Spirit so not sharing glory with another but with one and same. To include the disciples we recall that the Holy Spirit resides in the disciples. Not conflict or contradiction.
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RE: explain apparent conflict - 6/25/2008 12:56:08 PM
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DaveW
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We are IN HIM. It is only if you look at all believers and the Trinity as totally seperated individuals that a conflict arises. I submit to you that is not the biblical viewpoint.
John 17.20 "I do not ask for these only, but also for those who will believe in me through their word,
21 that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me.
22 The glory that you have given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one,
23 I in them and you in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that you sent me and loved them even as you loved me.
< Message edited by DaveW -- 6/25/2008 1:03:09 PM >
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RE: explain apparent conflict - 6/26/2008 6:19:56 PM
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Machaira
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quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
\Isa 42:8 (ESV) 8 I am the LORD; that is my name; my glory I give to no other, nor my praise to carved idols.
\Isa 48:11 (ESV) 11 For my own sake, for my own sake, I do it, for how should my name£ be profaned? My glory I will not give to another.
John 17:22 (ESV) 22 The glory that you have given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one,
This is a very interesting question. So much so that I checked every commentary that I have and was disappointed with every answer except one.
First it appears that not all glory is the same 'kind' of glory. You'll see that what is meant by 'glory' is determined by the context in which it is used.
Isa. 42:8 - [God] . . .will not ultimately tolerate the granting to dead gods the praise due to Him alone. - The Prophesy Of Isaiah, p. 328, J. Alec Moyter
Isa 48:11 - “I will not suffer my glory to be taken from me.” This would have happened, if the God of Israel had been mocked on account of the ruin and destruction of the people; as wicked men, when the people of God were oppressed, were wont to taunt them with blasphemies of this sort, “Where is their God?” (Psa_79:10.) Moses also assigned a familar reason why the Lord was unwilling to destroy the whole nation. “Lest perhaps,” says he, “their enemies should claim it for themselves, and say, It is our lofty hand, and not the Lord, that hath done all this.” (Deu_32:27.) - John Calvin
God will not have his purpose for Israel thwarted and be made to look impotent before the nations. (My two cents on Isa. 48:11)
John 17:22 - When believers are in Christ then Christ is in them. This is their glory. By “the glory which thou hast given me” Jesus refers to the fact that the Father manifested himself in the Son (“thou in me,” verse 21). By “I have given them” he means that he (i.e., Jesus) manifested himself in the lives of believers. To be able to say, “Christ only, always, living in us,” is their glory.
Believers become partakers of Christ, and in that sense, of the divine nature (cf. I John 3:2; II Cor. 3:18; Heb. 12:10; II Pet. 1:4). The glory which Jesus gives to believers means that they have become one plant with him; that he cannot be conceived of apart from them; that he is the source of all the blessings which they will ever receive; and that they, in turn, earnestly desire and strive to do everything to please him.
Hendriksen, W., & Kistemaker, S. J. 1953-2001. Vol. 1-2: New Testament commentary : Exposition of the Gospel According to John. New Testament Commentary.
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RE: explain apparent conflict - 6/26/2008 10:16:11 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2605
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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quote:
Believers become partakers of Christ, and in that sense, of the divine nature (cf. I John 3:2; II Cor. 3:18; Heb. 12:10; II Pet. 1:4). The glory which Jesus gives to believers means that they have become one plant with him; that he cannot be conceived of apart from them; that he is the source of all the blessings which they will ever receive; and that they, in turn, earnestly desire and strive to do everything to please him.
Good explanation.
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