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[Poll]
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What comes first? Understanding or Salvation
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| Salvation comes first |
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| Understanding Scripture comes first |
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| It's different for everyone |
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| It's a combination of both |
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| other |
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Total Votes : 16
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(last vote on : 5/8/2008 10:55:30 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/18/2008 6:09:21 PM
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Beanteaser
Posts: 238
Joined: 6/23/2005
From: Minnesota
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I am curious as to what people believe. In a different thread, most people seem to support the idea that salvation comes before understanding Scriptures. I believe Scripture must be either heard or read and then understood first.
So what do you think?
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/18/2008 9:45:56 PM
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heavensmailman
Posts: 97
Joined: 2/23/2008
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Luke-9:20-21 Jesus said: " But what about you?" He asked. " Who do you say I am? " Peter answered, " The Christ ! of God." Jesus strictly warned them not to tell this to anyone.
They all believed, but did they understand?
Luke-24:44-45 Jesus speaking to his disciples: He said to them, " This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms." Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures.
Luke-2:28-32 Simeon took him ( Jesus) in his arms and praised God, Saying: " Sovereign Lord, as you have promised, you now dismiss your servant in peace. For my eyes have seen your salvation, which you have prepared in the sight of all people, a light for revelation to the Gentiles and for glory to your people Israel."
John-3:10-11 Jesus said to Nicodemus: " You are Israel's teacher," said Jesus, " and do you not understand these things? I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony."
John-19:39 He ( Joseph of Arimathea ) was accompanied by Nicodemus, the man who earlier had visited Jesus at night.
Did Peter believe, yet he did not understand? Did Nicodemus not understand, yet he believed?
Salvation is first, understanding may come later, but understanding is not needed to get into heaven. WE must believe every word that comes from the mouth of God our Father. We don't have to understand any of it, but we must believe all of it. Peace
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/19/2008 4:08:59 PM
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rileykins
Posts: 194
Joined: 4/12/2005
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this might give us a clue.....
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?..................
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom.10
rileykins
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/19/2008 7:52:55 PM
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heavensmailman
Posts: 97
Joined: 2/23/2008
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If anyone needs to understand to believe, is this faith?
If anyone believes, and yet they don't understand, is this faith?
John-20:28-29 Thomas said to him, " My Lord and my God ! "
Then Jesus told him, " Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."
With our faith, we believe, yet we don't understand many things, atleast I don't. I do read the word of God our Father and read It again and again and somethings I just don't understand, but I believe every word.
Peace
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/20/2008 9:14:52 AM
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WesP
Posts: 1501
Joined: 11/28/2005
From: Where God needs me to be
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rileykins
this might give us a clue.....
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?..................
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom.10
rileykins
A small amount of understanding is necessary at first, and it becomes coupled with salvation. Then comes greater understanding throughout life.
_____________________________
Peace,
Wes
Isaiah 40:31 But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/24/2008 10:57:53 AM
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heavensmailman
Posts: 97
Joined: 2/23/2008
Status: offline
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#1 Hearing the word of God.
#2 Seaking the truth.
#3 Believing EVERy word that come from the mouth of our Father.
#4 Obeying ALL of his COMMANDS and LAWS.
#5 Believing that we are saved through the blood of Jesus.
#6 Asking for forgives of our sins.
#7 Knowing that God love us, he allowed us men to kill him.
What comes first? HEARING, SEAKING, BELIEVING, OBEYING, ASKING, KNOWING.
Our Salvation, we need to hear, seak, believe, obey, ask, know , because we are seaking our salvation from God, through Jesus.
I never ask God why. I don't have to understand, but I must believe.
If I were to ask God why, I feel that it might seem that I don't truat him.
I don't need to know WHY, I don't have to UNDERSTAND, all I need to do is TRUST HIM!
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/24/2008 5:55:12 PM
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jfaye
Posts: 702
Joined: 12/18/2007
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This was in regard to the Jews, but I'm thinking it may well apply to us all. We must first act in faith, not having
all the answers but having a heart to believe, and with that act of faith comes understanding.
1 Corinthians 2:13-16
"But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil
remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ.
But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart;
but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away"
However, it may be sort of an instantaneous act of both decision and enough understanding of what it is to have
faith and to believe, as well.
Romans 10:17
"So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ."
_____________________________
Thankfully His,
Janice
"We cannot appreciate God's mercy until we realize He is first the God of justice!"
"O taste and see that the LORD is good;
How blessed is the one who takes refuge in Him!"
Psalm 34:8
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/24/2008 9:20:22 PM
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Dr.Luke
Posts: 4
Joined: 3/15/2008
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I think we should first understand what to believe in or else we would believe everything told us, even those taught by false prophets or teachings of other religions.
We believe in everything the Bible teaches for we know that God's word is so true and that God cannot lie. That is understanding that His words will never fail, and that His way of salvation is sure and perfect.
I believe faith in God should not be blind faith. We should have reasons why we believe. Even God convinced Moses on why he(Moses) should trust in Him and obey His words.
The Bereans, in Acts, studied the word of God everyday to check whether what is preached by Paul is true. They seek understanding.
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 3/25/2008 3:33:04 AM
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Melitac
Posts: 156
Joined: 2/9/2008
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I think that The Good News can be spread correctly with Salvation as a result without directly quoting scripture.
The church has a history of keeping the Word from the peoples. Bibles were only to be possesed by preists.
The "common person" was forbidden to possess a Bible. But I do not believe this lack of biblical posession or the reading or hearing of it has kept people from Salvation. I feel sure that The Message can be given without quoting scripture.
Oftentimes our foreign missionaries are restricted from using the Bible or even quoting scripture.
(this was a common issue for many missionaries serving in the lands that suffered the tsunami)
But they still manage to get The Point across and salvation happens. Even without the reading/understanding of the scriptures. I believe these are cases of pure and real faith.
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 4/9/2008 12:40:50 PM
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restored08
Posts: 77
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Beanteaser
I am curious as to what people believe. In a different thread, most people seem to support the idea that salvation comes before understanding Scriptures. I believe Scripture must be either heard or read and then understood first.
So what do you think?
Understanding is grasping and believing the meaning of. So to me you have to grasp the meaning of what salvation is and believe how salvation comes. But then it's the Holy Spirit, whom reveals all things, that gives understanding so in that aspect salvation comes first. Because you are later filled with the Holy Spirit that gives understanding of scripture.
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 4/19/2008 10:06:38 PM
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deborlie
Posts: 68
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
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I hope I am not misunderstanding your question. This is something that was pointed out to me, as I wondered the same thing.
My answer that the first thing that must happen is
GOD.
John's Gospel 10:29 "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand."
By this I think it is meant that those who come to Jesus, was brought to Him by God, His Father.
No one can attempt to bring
another into God's saving grace without God's reaching
out to that other one first. Any good intentions otherwise
would be greatly misunderstood. So your being saved,
in the first place, was God's idea!
It all begins with God.
He is telling you HE WANTS YOU!
You realize you have a need.
That something big is indeed missing in your life.
You can’t be saved until you know you are lost.
God clues you in:
Luke 15: 4 (Jesus’ own words)
"What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if
he loses one of them, does not leave the
ninety-nine in the wilderness,
and go after the one which is lost
until he finds it?
5."And when he has found it, he lays it
on his shoulders, rejoicing
6."And when he comes home, he calls together
his friends and neighbors,
saying to them ‘Rejoice with me, for I have
found my sheep which was lost!"..
7."I say to you that likewise there, will be
more joy in heaven over one
sinner who repents than over ninety-nine
just persons who need no repentance.
The Shepherd left the ninety and nine sheep (Israel) to look for
the one. The one knew he was lost, his bleating said so.
The others (the ninety and nine)had no idea they were lost,
(..........without their Shepherd.)
but the one knowing, could be saved.
The joy of the Shepherd over that saved one!
The Scripture can be read by anyone capable of reading.
But true understanding, direction, conviction comes at the directing of the Holy Spirit. You don't acquire the Holy Spirit until you've accepted Jesus Christ as your Savior, your Lord. Then the truth in understanding process begins. You read your Scripture very different than before, with meaning, and hunger.
2 Tim 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God,
and is profitable for doctrine,
for reproof,
for correction,
for instruction in righteousness,
17.0 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.
This dosen't quite go along with what you think you believe, but give it another whirl.
Keep asking questions.
In Christ,
BJ
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 4/19/2008 10:16:40 PM
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Ephesians4_32
Posts: 2287
Joined: 4/30/2005
From: The Crossroads of America
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rileykins
this might give us a clue.....
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?..................
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Rom.10
rileykins
Yep.
2 Timothy 2
25In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
Matthew 16
15He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
It sounds like hearing and being convinced by God can happen at the same time.
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 4/20/2008 2:28:01 PM
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eschatologist
Posts: 28
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Beanteaser
I am curious as to what people believe. In a different thread, most people seem to support the idea that salvation comes before understanding Scriptures. I believe Scripture must be either heard or read and then understood first.
So what do you think?
This is really a loaded question, so I didn't even answer the poll. You do have to hear the gospel of Salvation in order to recieve it and be saved. That's why Jesus told His disciples to "go into all the world and preach the Gospel to every creature." Mark 16:15
And Paul tells us in Romans 10:14-15 "How then shall they call on Him whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!"
And Peter tells us in IPeter 1:25 "But the word of the Lord endureth forever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you."
So you do have to hear the gospel in order for you to believe it and recieve it and be saved. But this does not necessarily mean that you have to understand it and have all your questions and doubts answered first. What is there to understand? This is the gospel of Salvation: We've all been bad and deserving of punishment for all our sins and bad behaviour. But our great and loving Father in Heaven loved us so much that He didn't want to send us to hell to be punished for our sins. So He lovingly sent His own Son, Jesus, into the world to die for us and take our punishment for us. So, now all we have to do is believe in and recieve Jesus and accept His forgivness for our sins. Then He washes away our sins and takes us to heaven to live with Him instead of to hell to be punished.
Our understanding will come later as we grow and mature in the Lord. As Peter says: "As newborn Babes desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby.' (IPeter2:2)
And as Paul says: "Faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God."
Our Faith and understanding will grow as we mature and grow in the Lord and as we read and study His word. The tiny seed of Faith is sown when we first hear the gospel of Salvation and this tiny seed is all it takes to recieve Jesus and get saved. But then our Faith and understanding of these spritual truths will grow as we read and study God's word.
"If ye continue in my word then are ye my disciples indeed and ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free." (Jesus: Somewhere in John 8)
So to put your poll into perspective and to clarify the point, it would be more according to scripture to say: Hearing the word of Salvation comes first, then believing and recieving it without doubting, then understanding it comes later as we grow in the Lord.
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RE: What comes first? Understanding or Salvation - 4/20/2008 5:24:54 PM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 1732
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline
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I have a degree in Biblical studies, and I still don't understand salvation at all. God help me if I ever think that I comprehend His mysterious. I only have but a glimpse on this side of heaven.
_____________________________
-Ben-
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