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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 4:07:31 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2579
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With individuals such as Darth Vader Ginsberg on the Court, we aren't too far behind.
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 4:12:28 PM
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ElmerFishpaw
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....bout time! Apes have been getting the short end of the stick for ages.
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 4:15:47 PM
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Stronger2day
Posts: 106
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PETA is gonna love pushing similiar laws in the US-except they will extend to all animals. Say goodbye to your filet mignons...someday they may call it cannibalism, since we'd be eating our own 'kind'. Oh brother- I'm against cruelty to animals- but this goes to far.
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"The journey from your mind to your hands is shorter than you're thinking. Be careful if you think you stand, you just might be sinking."
(Slow Fade/Casting Crowns)
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 9:34:49 PM
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everythingat
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It seems that if the words "evolutionary comrades" weren't used, this topic wouldn't be much of a joke. These "rights" they're extending aren't really such a bad idea...improving zoos, not allowed to be used for harmful experiments...yeah, doesn't sound that bad.
quote:
The new resolutions have cross-party or majority support and are expected to become law and the government is now committed to update the statute book within a year to outlaw harmful experiments on apes in Spain.
"We have no knowledge of great apes being used in experiments in Spain, but there is currently no law preventing that from happening," Pozas said.
Keeping apes for circuses, television commercials or filming will also be forbidden and breaking the new laws will become an offence under Spain's penal code.
Keeping an estimated 315 apes in Spanish zoos will not be illegal, but supporters of the bill say conditions will need to improve drastically in 70 percent of establishments to comply with the new law.
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 9:42:51 PM
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Stronger2day
Posts: 106
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These are the words that scare me:
"...our closest genetic relatives deserve rights hitherto limited to humans."
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"The journey from your mind to your hands is shorter than you're thinking. Be careful if you think you stand, you just might be sinking."
(Slow Fade/Casting Crowns)
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 10:14:49 PM
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HisFish
Posts: 552
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: Rocky mountain way
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quote:
It seems that if the words "evolutionary comrades" weren't used, this topic wouldn't be much of a joke. These "rights" they're extending aren't really such a bad idea...improving zoos, not allowed to be used for harmful experiments...yeah, doesn't sound that bad.
Assuming that this is the extent of their agenda. something tells me this is just one brick that a wall will be built upon.
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The theology of the present aims at the deification of man, but the truth of all time
magnifies God . C. H. Spurgeon
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/26/2008 11:20:19 PM
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djv1255
Posts: 152
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The circus owners should say since the ape have the right to freedom we are going to release our apes into any forests/woods around the capitol.
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/27/2008 6:48:26 PM
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fiat_lux
Posts: 290
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From: Ottawa
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quote:
Isn't it amazing that some people afford animals more "human rights" than they afford real humans?!
It's a small comfort, but I'm pretty sure Spain's abortion laws are among the most restrictive in Europe. More restrictive than those where I live, certainly.
According to the article linked to, this is Parliament, not a court, and it's a proposal only at this stage. And the "rights" in question are basically just a moderate extension of the prevention of what elsewhere is usually called cruelty to animals. I really don't see why this is worth losing sleep over.
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/27/2008 8:52:26 PM
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Stronger2day
Posts: 106
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quote:
ORIGINAL: fiat_lux
quote:
Isn't it amazing that some people afford animals more "human rights" than they afford real humans?!
It's a small comfort, but I'm pretty sure Spain's abortion laws are among the most restrictive in Europe. More restrictive than those where I live, certainly.
According to the article linked to, this is Parliament, not a court, and it's a proposal only at this stage. And the "rights" in question are basically just a moderate extension of the prevention of what elsewhere is usually called cruelty to animals. I really don't see why this is worth losing sleep over.
You're right this is not, nor is anything, worth loosing sleep over, but I do believe the observation made by HISFISH is right on:
"Assuming that this is the extent of their agenda. something tells me this is just one brick that a wall will be built upon."
We will hear more of this in the future, and it will be more than preventing animal cruelty. By evaluating the specific terminology used to explain their position, one can easily see that the gates have been opened to push the issue further in the future.
_____________________________
"The journey from your mind to your hands is shorter than you're thinking. Be careful if you think you stand, you just might be sinking."
(Slow Fade/Casting Crowns)
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/27/2008 9:12:21 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2579
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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quote:
Will affirmative action cover them as far as employment and college placement?. Also they have a constituancy that will need representation in government.
and the dems will demand one-stop voting at the zoo
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/28/2008 12:33:09 AM
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fiat_lux
Posts: 290
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From: Ottawa
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quote:
We will hear more of this in the future, and it will be more than preventing animal cruelty. By evaluating the specific terminology used to explain their position, one can easily see that the gates have been opened to push the issue further in the future.
If I may ask, what do you believe the consequences in the future might be?
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/28/2008 1:53:07 AM
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Stronger2day
Posts: 106
Joined: 5/26/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: fiat_lux
quote:
We will hear more of this in the future, and it will be more than preventing animal cruelty. By evaluating the specific terminology used to explain their position, one can easily see that the gates have been opened to push the issue further in the future.
If I may ask, what do you believe the consequences in the future might be?
OK, allow me to locate my thinking cap….and some coffee. If I were to theorize a possible route….
First, get the majority of the population agreeing to protect animals under the guise of eliminating animal cruelty when in fact the language may suggest intent to press evolutionary theory. Once that ‘comfort’ has been obtained, now we give more protection over time some of the primates. The ‘rights’ may first be afforded with those sharing 95% DNA similarities, next monkeys up to 88%. We may then argue that rodents shouldn’t be excluded (while only 25% or so shared DNA). Now let’s apply rights, not based on DNA groupings, but to all animals- because we are ALL just animals-right? We are eventually, even if over a significant period of time, in a place where animals are extended comparable rights to humans. In short can’t eat them and don’t think about accidentally running over one. Again, PETA would LOVE to start pushing this thinking through. Take a look at what they are pushing through in some of the (US) states now. It looks innocent, but I do feel there will be more to come from this.
Had the language of the proposed law excluded:
"...our closest genetic relatives deserve rights hitherto limited to humans”, and
"This is a historic day in the struggle for animal rights and in defense of our evolutionary comrades”
I would be much less skeptical.
Also, I feel that this language represents a thumbing of noses to our Savior with evolutionary references.
While I admit my ‘draft theory’ may be significantly flawed, I am demonstrating a route by which the envelope could be pushed. One may use the homosexual marriage as an example. It took one ‘brick’ at a time, but somehow that ‘wall’ has been built (using previous poster’s verbiage). The ‘majority’ doesn’t agree, yet somehow our lovely US courts have opined it though. Combine US courts and unscrutinizing citizens and anything is possible.
_____________________________
"The journey from your mind to your hands is shorter than you're thinking. Be careful if you think you stand, you just might be sinking."
(Slow Fade/Casting Crowns)
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/28/2008 11:43:01 AM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2133
Joined: 5/16/2005
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The problem is not the raising of an animal to the level of humans. . .
It's the lower of the importance of humans, and what separates us.
We are slowly becoming no different, no more important, than an mere animal.
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RE: Spanish court grants apes rights. - 6/28/2008 12:38:20 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2579
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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quote:
Combine US courts and unscrutinizing citizens and anything is possible
We have SC justices who admit they make their decisions on the laws of other countries rather than jurisprudence. Read Mark Levin's Men in Black for a good discussion on bad case law.
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