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On the issue of forgiveness...... - 4/27/2008 10:10:51 PM
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Prairiehiker
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Joined: 12/11/2007
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I need help on this issue. I think I can be very forgiving but I can also be very unforgiving. I know that doesn't make sense but I'll explain. When someone does something to me, I can easily just forgive and forget but if it's repeated a few times, I get hardened to the point where I don't want to relate to the person anymore. I'm currently struggling with this situation with my friend. We weren't that close, but we always did things together....like go on vacations, or go to the beach, or go hiking/skiing, etc. But we've never talked about deep personal feelings.
Anyway, she's pretty consistent and reliable when we make plans except for the past few months, she's agreed to do things with me then she ends up making plans with someone else without even cancelling our plans. It happened New Years eve. She made plans with me, then went somewhere else. During spring break, she agreed to go on vacation with me, then as soon as someone else asked her to go elsewhere, she went without even cancelling on our plans. I was upset the first time, but forgave her and made plans with her again. But I have a hard time with her action about spring break.
I've prayed to God about my feelings of resentment. So far, I don't feel upset, but I feel like not having anything to do with her. Is this unforgiveness? And how should I relate to this person from now on?
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 4/28/2008 12:03:01 AM
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creationtalk
Posts: 599
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quote:
I've prayed to God about my feelings of resentment. So far, I don't feel upset, but I feel like not having anything to do with her. Is this unforgiveness? And how should I relate to this person from now on?
I once had a so-called friend who did that with me, so my first impulse is to be pretty harsh about your friend. However, not knowing both sides of the story...I guess that you have two options:
1) Meet with your friend and let her know how hurt you have been that she would make plans with you and then not follow through without calling to cancel. How she responds and future behavior will let you know if this was merely thoughtless or if she doesn't care about you.
2) Decide you've had enough, let it go, but do not make any future plans including this person. You can be friendly when you meet without having any expectations of any time for this person. If she wants to get together, just say you can't.
If you do not want anything to do with this person in the future, you are not required to do so. The Bible says to forgive and to turn the other cheek, but it also says to be wise as serpents and harmless as doves and not to cast pearls before swine. If this person is not a true friend to you, then it seems wise to find others with whom to spend your time.
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 4/29/2008 9:02:13 PM
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mrtigger
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Prairiehiker
Anyway, she's pretty consistent and reliable when we make plans except for the past few months, she's agreed to do things with me then she ends up making plans with someone else without even cancelling our plans. It happened New Years eve. She made plans with me, then went somewhere else. During spring break, she agreed to go on vacation with me, then as soon as someone else asked her to go elsewhere, she went without even cancelling on our plans. I was upset the first time, but forgave her and made plans with her again. But I have a hard time with her action about spring break.
I've prayed to God about my feelings of resentment. So far, I don't feel upset, but I feel like not having anything to do with her. Is this unforgiveness? And how should I relate to this person from now on?
Did you talk to her about how her doing this upsets & hurts you? If not, that is what I think you should do. If you did so already, and she has continued doing it, I personally wouldn't make any plans or do anything more with her. I'd just forgive and forget but move on from that relationship.
Forgiving someone doesn't mean you have to continue in a relationship with them.
_____________________________
mr tigger
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 4/29/2008 10:33:13 PM
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deermousie
Posts: 1269
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A person who can stand you up for an event as big as a vacation (lots of time, planning, days off and money involved) and not even let you know or feel remorse is not worried about your time, planning efforts, precious days off or money. Or your feelings. That's really cold on her part.
So you know she's thoughtless and cold. If we know monkeys eat bananas then we shouldn't be surprised when a monkey eats another banana. She's probably going to keep doing this to you. Want to spend your time, planning efforts, days off and money waiting for someone who isn't coming?
We forgive people, especially when they admit their sin against us and ask for forgiveness. She hasn't done these things to mend the break in your relationship. You can forgive her, but don't lie down in front of her car anymore.
She's earned a place in your "acquaintance" list and not on the "friend" list. I'd be polite to her when you see her, but nothing more, and would politely turn down any plans to do things with her in the future.
_____________________________
Want to know where a certain word or phrase in the Bible is found? www.biblegateway.com Yay!
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 4/29/2008 11:11:45 PM
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Prairiehiker
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To clarify, we didn't have all our plans in details. I brought up to her about spring break and asked her if she wanted to go to Minneapolis because we have kids that are the same age. She said, she'd love to. Then the next time I saw her again, I asked if she's still coming with me, and she said of course, she's coming. So I started making plans. Then we saw each other again during the Superbowl and she said that she's going with another friend to Cuba during spring break but never said anything about our plans to go to Minneapolis. I didn't bring it up as I was just hurt that she'd just do that. I haven't talked to her since then. She sent an email to her closest friends, me included, about what's going on in her life, and I never responded to it. I thought what she did was thoughtless. I know if I had a tentative plan, before I start making plans with someone else, I'd talk to that person first and clear everything. But she didn't do that.
Having thought about this for the past few months, this person always makes plans with me when she's got no one else to do things with, or when she wants to use my car (I have an SUV which is bigger, and better for snowy conditions). She's a nice person, and I considered her to be a real friend. We did a lot of things together in the past, because we shared some common interests. But obviously, she didn't respect me enough, or value our friendship. I know I'll never see her the same way again.
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/2/2008 2:23:07 PM
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mostofall
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There is an important difference between forgiveness and opening yourself up to being hurt again. You can forgive and at the same time learn from your experiences so that it doesn't happen again. ("I forgive you for being so inconsiderate and thoughtless, but I am going to choose not to make any further vacation plans with you because I cannot count on you to follow through.") Ask a different friend, one who really does want to spend time with you, to go next time.
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/2/2008 2:53:01 PM
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Cloak
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Your friend did Not show respect to you when she did some other plan with somebody else without even notifying you in advance. This shows lack of respect toward you. If you have good self-esteem, that should make you be rightfully angry.
Ideally, if you're Christian, you should forgive her and keep her at arm's length. If she is a sincere friend, she should call you up as quick as possible to explain to you her unreasonable inconsiderate disrespectful behaviour AND apologize. Otherwise, you will wind up doing plans without knowing if you will do them alone or with her. No, she does Not sound a reliable trustworthy and respectful friend and your friend will continue to repeat her conduct over and over. Ask yourself: Is this the kind of friendship you're looking for? Would you do this to your friends???
All the best!
< Message edited by Cloak -- 5/2/2008 5:23:00 PM >
_____________________________
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/2/2008 3:12:37 PM
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hotsaucygma
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I think you need to sit down and talk to her about how you felt when she made other plans over spring break. It may have been a good idea to have shared the "making plans" part of your spring break too- a few phone calls regarding where to stay and what to do, etc. I know Superbowl was later than usual this year, but if she hadn't heard anything about the trip in awhile, maybe she thought it wasn't being planned? Regardless, I think it would be best to sit down and talk and not to just stop communicating or seeing her without a conversation about why you were doing so. Friends hurt each other from time to time, but part of being friends is working it out together. If you can't talk it out and come to agreement, then you may need to break ties, or limit them.
_____________________________
Dear Lord, let my words today be as sweet and delicious as cheesecake... for tomorrow I may have to eat them!
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/2/2008 5:14:51 PM
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saraimay75
Posts: 7071
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From: Wherever God plants me.
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Forgiving does not mean Forgetting.
Have I forgiven the teacher who called me stupid in my Sophmore (sp?) Geometry class. Or all the other mistreatment I got from teachers. Yes I have.
Do I remember how I felt and use it to better myself and what I am going to do? Yes I do.
I am going to be a teacher And remembering how I felt will help me when I teach. I do not want any child to feel how I felt...That I could not do anything.
Teaching is something I never ever thought I would do. But G-d had a different set of plans for me. G-d want me to teach. And I have found out through G-d that I NEED to teach.
If I had forgotten how I felt I would never have felt this NEED to teach.
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Then Jesus said, Father forgive them, for they know not what they do. Luke 23:34
http://360.yahoo.com/saraimay75
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/12/2008 1:45:41 AM
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brindylee
Posts: 6
Joined: 5/12/2008
From: Michigan's thumb
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Hi, I'm new here and have a similar issue w/a "friend" of mine.
We've known each other since the 8th grade (some---ahem---20+ years!). Anyway, we've had a lot of great times over the years (traveling, etc...), but in the past ten years or so things have changed. She's become (or has always been and I never really noticed) a very jealous person, not just of myself, but other friends as well.
She has said and done a lot of hurtful things to me, as I have, I believe, tried to be a good friend to her (encourage her, advise her, just be there for her....). Time and time again she has hurt me, and I keep forgiving her, but she never changes.
The "last straw" came last summer when I received a nasty email from her. W/out going into detail, she left me stunned and in tears. I felt like I didn't really know her at all. (she later admitted that she said the things she did to deliberately hurt me, thus making her feel better!?).
It took me a couple of weeks, but I finally contronted her (in person) about it. After talking to her, I told her I would forgive her (again), but that it may take some time before I felt I could gain her trust.
We talk on the phone maybe once a month now (when she calls me). I just still feel the hurt and feel like I need to stay away from her.
It's so hard, especially since I've known her so long, and we have had a lot of good times....but I just am tired of being hurt and don't feel like I can trust her anymore.
I'm really torn over this matter. As a Christian, I feel I should just forgive and put the matter behind me. But part of me wants nothing to do w/her at all.
Any thoughts?
brindylee
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/12/2008 1:22:12 PM
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preserved
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mostofall
There is an important difference between forgiveness and opening yourself up to being hurt again. You can forgive and at the same time learn from your experiences so that it doesn't happen again. ("I forgive you for being so inconsiderate and thoughtless, but I am going to choose not to make any further vacation plans with you because I cannot count on you to follow through.") Ask a different friend, one who really does want to spend time with you, to go next time.
I agree with this...In fact you need to sit down with this friend or email whatever you have to do...and simply say just what this OP has said. You will be then placing the guilt onto your so-call friend...start planning events with others
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/12/2008 2:20:09 PM
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RichLP
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I can somewhat relate to you, and since you've already gotten good advice, I'll just say this.
Ask yourself how close a friend this person is, and go from there. If it's a very close friend, then a serious conversation might be worthwhile. If not, disassociate yourself from this person.
Please note that you are reading the comments of someone who tends to be HOT or COLD, YES or NO; someone who doesn't have much tolerance for gray areas (but who acknowledges that he needs more flexibility and open-minded/open-heartedness, and is trying to improve).
Please note also that I have sought advice on "friends" from Crosswalkers and have gotten good feedback... I have, in the past 6 months, completely cut off and stayed away from a college-time acquaintance whose drama queen, ditzy antics made me want to punch a wall; and, drastically reduced time spent with a college-time friend who... well, STILL is a friend, but who is also somewhat flaky (his "crimes" include being 30 minutes to several hours late to social events that he had insisted he'd attend, last-minute changes of plans affecting others who live far away, a narrow-minded refusal to go to certain restaurants) but with whom I have much less contact now.
We cannot change others - but we can certainly prevent them from affecting our lives adversely by limiting the time and contact they have with us.
I hope this all helps.
_____________________________
"We have removed an ally of Al Qaeda" - G.W. Bush lies to America and to the world, 5/1/2003
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/12/2008 2:33:58 PM
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RichLP
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To the OP:
Your story reminds me of a story involving the friend with whom I’ve reduced contact.
“PAUL” is married and has 3 kids. He is habitually late – during the days I didn’t have a car, he would call me telling me he’d pick me up at a given time, almost “chide” me to ensure I’d be ready on time… and be 30 to 45 minutes late. What would irk me is that he would not call to tell me he’d be late, and I had to call him and ask him why he was late. He is STILL like this.
And I know this because “JONATHAN,” with whom I’ve developed a close friendship, is also friends with Paul… and has been made to wait by Paul many times. Jonathan, like Paul, is married with children.
One time, on a Sunday afternoon, Paul phoned Jonathan to ask Jonathan if he’d like to meet him at a park with the kids. Jonathan agreed, went to the said park with his children, and waited for Paul. Paul never came. 1 hour later, Jonathan phoned Paul and Paul said, “oh you know what, I’m really tired, so I don’t think I’ll go…”
When Jonathan told me this story I was flabbergasted at Paul’s rudeness.
But you think this is bad?
A few summers ago, when Jonathan and Paul each only had 2 children, they vacationed together. Jonathan is a multi-tasker and usually punctual. They booked the same flight, and Paul was late to arrive at the airport; Jonathan and his family nearly missed the plane because Paul was so late.
And, on the day they were to return (note that the vacation took place outside America), Paul was late checking out – in fact, he was so late that BOTH FAMILIES missed their flight back!
And yet, according to Jonathan, Paul said nothing to express remorse or to apologize – at the airport, when both men realized the plane had left, Jonathan and his wife scrambled to get tickets for a flight on the same day to avoid getting stuck in that foreign country for one more night (as they didn’t want to pay another hotel’s night stay).
Paul was nonchalant and just said, “you know, I’m hungry.”
Now note that Jonathan is far less blunt and confrontational than I am; in fact, I believe that my tendency to sometimes be confrontational when something annoys me has caused some friction between Paul and myself in the past. I asked Jonathan if he ever pulled Paul aside to complain, whether right there or afterwards – and Jonathan said “no.”
I told Jonathan, “man… if that was me… I would’ve just taken the flight without him.”
These stories totally coincide with the many occasions Paul was very late and did not call to inform me he’d be late when we had plans. Two years ago, in fact, Robert, another good friend of mine celebrated his birthday. Paul, I, and a 3rd person, Oddie, were to take Robert out. Neither Robert nor I were or are close to Oddie, but Paul liked Oddie and wanted him to come.
Oddie ordered more food than we expected and did not go along with our plan to treat Robert. So Robert ended up paying on a night he was to eat for free. And then, Oddie, Robert, and I went to a bar for beer, and only THEN Paul arrived. I think my face showed anger at Paul’s lateness, for Paul barely looked at me. And frankly, I don’t think Paul really understood the wrongfulness of his action; and again, Paul never called either Robert or me to tell us he’d be late.
Don’t be surprised, therefore, when I tell you that after I started getting close to Jonathan and thus heard from Jonathan how Paul is often flaky, late, and all, that it became that much easier for me to pull away from Paul. There were other factors – his narrow-mindedness, his refusal to eat certain foods, his refusal to go to certain establishments (none indecent).
Some people you are just best off not hanging out with.
< Message edited by RichLP -- 5/12/2008 4:38:42 PM >
_____________________________
"We have removed an ally of Al Qaeda" - G.W. Bush lies to America and to the world, 5/1/2003
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RE: On the issue of forgiveness...... - 5/12/2008 3:27:40 PM
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bzirk
Posts: 2921
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Where the deer and antelope play
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RichLP
I can somewhat relate to you, and since you've already gotten good advice, I'll just say this.
Ask yourself how close a friend this person is, and go from there. If it's a very close friend, then a serious conversation might be worthwhile. If not, disassociate yourself from this person.
Please note that you are reading the comments of someone who tends to be HOT or COLD, YES or NO; someone who doesn't have much tolerance for gray areas (but who acknowledges that he needs more flexibility and open-minded/open-heartedness, and is trying to improve).
Please note also that I have sought advice on "friends" from Crosswalkers and have gotten good feedback... I have, in the past 6 months, completely cut off and stayed away from a college-time acquaintance whose drama queen, ditzy antics made me want to punch a wall; and, drastically reduced time spent with a college-time friend who... well, STILL is a friend, but who is also somewhat flaky (his "crimes" include being 30 minutes to several hours late to social events that he had insisted he'd attend, last-minute changes of plans affecting others who live far away, a narrow-minded refusal to go to certain restaurants) but with whom I have much less contact now.
We cannot change others - but we can certainly prevent them from affecting our lives adversely by limiting the time and contact they have with us.
I hope this all helps.
Good post.
The bottom line is that forgiving someone does not mean that we erase all boundaries. But too often people equate forgiveness with no boundaries because world like to interpret "Turn the other cheek" and "Judge not lest you be judged" to mean no boundaries. The scriptures don't teach that.
_____________________________
Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus (Romans 8:1)
Great quote: I just ain't God and don't know it all. -- SonInMe1
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